It is our 3rd anniversary episode, as calculated by Nigel Dobson-Keeffe.
When Steve had a major birthday milestone this year, he asked a handful of close friends to come for dinner and to bring a eulogy for him. They were recorded in secret and have been edited by Michael to share in tonight’s program. He had not heard them yet. You and he will hear them together, for the first time.
Steve believes we should all write and record eulogies for our friends and present them at birthdays, and then update them as each year passes. It would spark deeper levels of conversation between us (for most of us) and give us time to steer our ships back from danger or to forge on towards worthy treasures.
To discuss this tonight, we have Brett Williams, Steve’s longest serving friend, who is a former Anglican priest and is now a systems/family therapist at Adelaide Night And Day Therapy, and Andrew Reimer, one of Steve’s radio buddies who is now also a sought-after celebrant.
We hear eulogies by:
- Brett Williams
- Michael Shanahan
- Simon Butters
- Adam Claridge
- Nigel Dobson-Keeffe
We discuss
- The importance of ritual
- The three things to say to our loved ones ritually each day
- What to add and remove from eulogies
- How to write eulogies
- What is the purpose of a eulogy
- Do eulogies help with the grieving process
Also appearing on life and death in Adelaide episode
In the musical pilgrimage, we hear a track written by our musical curator and sung by Alan O’Toole from the Shambolics
The SA Drinks Of The Week are from Bleasdale and Bygone Era
In IS IT NEWS, Michael tests us on death
And please consider becoming part of our podcast by joining our Inner Circle. It’s an email list. Join it and you might get an email on a Sunday or Monday seeking question ideas, guest ideas and requests for other bits of feedback about YOUR podcast, The Adelaide Show. Email us directly and we’ll add you to the list: podcast@theadelaideshow.com.au
If you enjoy the show, please leave us a review in iTunes or other podcast sites. We’d greatly appreciate it.
Show notes running sheet by timecode
Looking for something in this episode? We have captured the time marker in the notes below to help you find selected content faster.
| TIME | SEGMENT |
| 00:00:00 | Outtake |
| Thank god it’s not boring anymore | |
| 00:00:18 | Theme |
| Theme and introduction. Our original theme song in full is here, Adelaidey-hoo. | |
| 00:00:00 |
Talk Of The Town |
| David is on extended leave and will return later in 2016.
David Washington, editor of In Daily, gives us a midweek wrap of the news we’ve been talking about in South Australia this week. |
|
| 00:02:28 | SA Drink Of The Week |
| Bleasdale 2013 Mulberry Tree Langhorne Creek Cabernet Sauvignon and Byegone Era2014 McLaren Vale Shiraz … tasting notes | |
| 00:07:24 | Items Without Notice |
We are three years old today. We began as Another Boring Thursday Night In Adelaide as an ironic title to stare down anybody who held that statement as being plausible. We rebranded as The Adelaide Show in episode 80. Now, I had thought our third birthday would have been last week (episode 52 x 3 = 156) but Nigel corrected the record:
I have two things to play you. First, the opening two minutes of episode number one in which myself, Brett and Colin gathered around a small table in a room out the back of my house. [Play intro of episode 001] Next, Brett Monten eventually created the theme by about episode 11 but little did we know that he had been playing with ideas for a theme while home alone with a few bourbons in hand. He was also trying to work out how tongue-in-cheek to be with our ironic title and this draft is not quite ironic enough. I shouldn’t REALLY play this but it’s not a bad little toe tapper and it stars a cat, which has to be good for internet popularity. [Play Brett’s draft theme song] |
|
| 00:22:52 | Brett Williams and Andrew Reimer |
| When I had a major birthday milestone this year, I asked a handful of close friends to come for dinner and to bring a eulogy for me. They were recorded in secret and have been edited by Michael to share in tonight’s program. I have not heard them yet. You and I will hear them together, for the first time.
I asked them to do this because I believe the closest we get to learning about what our lasting impact and memories will be within our communities and families, are mainly shared in eulogies, at which point it is too late for us to get an inkling as to how much or little those around us valued us and our interactions with them. I believe we should all write and record eulogies for our friends and present them at birthdays, and then update them as each year passes. It would spark deeper levels of conversation between us (for most of us) and give us time to steer our ships back from danger or to forge on towards worthy treasures. To discuss this tonight, I have Brett Williams, my longest serving friend, who is a former Anglican priest and is now a systems/family therapist at Adelaide Night And Day Therapy, and Andrew Reimer, a radio buddy who is now also a sought-after celebrant at Andrew Reimer Registered Civil Celebrant. Eulogies are presented by:
|
|
| 02:26:07 | Is It News? |
| The news history quiz with Nigel Dobson-Keeffe. Read the stories. They get published each Sunday. This week, Michael Shanahan delivers the quiz. | |
| 00:00:00 | Adelaide Visa Council |
| No cases this week. | |
| 02:39:27 | Musical Pilgrimage |
| And our song this week is Oh Brother by Alan O’Toole, selected by our musical curator Dan Drummond. | |
| 02:51:22 | Outtake |
| What do you call yourself, Andrew Reimer? | |
Here is this week’s preview video:
SFX: Throughout the podcast we use free sfx from freesfx.co.uk for the harp, the visa stamp, the silent movie music, the stylus, the radio signal sfx, the wine pouring and cork pulling sfx, and the swooshes around Siri.
Transcript
This was made by a machine and WILL contain errors. Here for reference only.
157 TAS
===
[00:00:00] Yeah. Three years. All right. Congratulations, by the way. Thank you. Here’s to three years. Yes. Uh, can we clink? Cheers. Three years of the Adelaide show. Three years of the Adelaide show. One more joyful night in Adelaide. Mm. Yeah. Thank God it’s not boring anymore.
We’ll be the judge of that.
Way more waves just got a bad
Adelaidey-oo. Ten pound bombs on the refugees. Adelaidey-Adelaidey Lady-oo. Brings you down on your surly knees. Adelaidey-Adelaidey-oo. Oh, oh, little Adelaidey. Oh, oh, Adelaidey-oo. Oh, oh, little Adelaidey. Little Adelaidey-oo
Hello, and welcome to The Adelaide Show, the weekly podcast that puts South Australia on center stage. I’m [00:01:00] Steve Davis, and joining me here by the sea at Brighton tonight, I have Michael Shanahan. Hello. Andrew Reimer. Good evening. And Brett Williams. Brett Williams from Adelaide Night & Day Family Therapy, and although Steve thought we were at Brighton, we’re actually at Glenelg South, where Adelaide Night & Day Family Therapy looks after your families.
I’m glad you corrected the record. Along with The Adelaide Show. But once I see those pine trees, it all sort of blends into the same place. Andrew Reimer, you’re here not with your Five AA hat tonight. Mm. You’re here as celebrant extraordinaire. I don’t know about extraordinaire, Steve, but it’s certainly something that I do as part of my way to make a living.
The SA drinks of the week this week, Andrew Reimer’s brought them along. Is it news? Michael, what’s the theme? The theme for this week is death, but don’t be put off by that because it’s not a doom and gloom view of death. I think it’s gonna be an interesting view of death. We’re all born to die at the end of the day.
First thing that came to mind when you said that was actually the, the idea that actually sometimes we die before we die. Yeah. And, uh, [00:02:00] that sometimes, like some of Michael’s jokes. All that and a whole lot more coming up on this week’s episode of The Adelaide Show. Adelaide, Adelaide, Adelaide
Welcome to episode 157, the third birthday anniversary of The Adelaide Show, and couldn’t be sharing it with a nicer bunch of people tonight. Andrew Reimer in particular because he’s brought the South Australian drinks of the week this week, uh, which I’m looking forward to, um, to sipping upon. But our first order of business, as it has been for 157 weeks, is to toast our late patron, Queen Adelaide.
So, gentlemen, would you raise your glasses to the Queen. To the Queen. To the Queen. And all who may [00:03:00] sail in her. The first of the two South Australian drinks of the week, uh, we have this week is a Bleasdale Cab Sav. What made you select this one, Andrew? The Bleasdale, it’s, um… I, I stumbled across it probably two or three years ago And it’s just a really enjoyable wine.
I’m not a big wine drinker. Um, I prefer spirits actually. Um, this maybe has something to do with the whole funeral celebrancy thing. I don’t, I’m not really sure. Uh, but the- The whole experience. Well, I, I, I promise as a funeral celebrant, I’ll be the last person to let you down. The-
Well, you bury your mistakes anyway, don’t you? No, that’s doctors.
The, the, the, yeah, I just enjoy it, Steve. So that was the choice. You know- Hmm … it’s funny you mention that you like, um, the spirits because- Hmm … there is a strong spirit element to this wine. It’s got a, um, there is that middle high note on the palate that’s a bit spirity. Hmm. What are you [00:04:00] getting, Brett?
It’s a very, very smooth wine. Um, a, the sort of porty- Yes, that’s- … fruity thing, but it’s not, it’s not like that. Fortified. Yeah, it- That fortified … it’s got the smoothness- Yeah … of the fortified without that- Yeah … that sickliness of it. Um- And it’s got a little hint of the, just a hint of eucalypt, which you expect from Cab Sav as well, which is nice.
Andrew, what did you get? I just like it. You just like it. I just like it. You just like it. I think it’s got beautiful stewed fruit character. Blueberries. I get blueberries. Mm. When I, when I drink this, I get blueberries. It reminds me a little bit of stewed apricots for breakfast. You know that- Oh … slightly tart- Yes
but beautifully fruity flavor. To, it- Hmm … it tastes to me like it needs to breathe a little bit. Yeah. Probably quite young. Give it mouth to mouth. Oh. I haven’t. And, and certainly breakfast is the best time for something slightly tart- Hmm … because you don’t want to just have an avalanche of sugar. Well, which one do you start breakfast with, Ja- Uh, it’s funny, I was waiting for someone to say that it had a taste of mulberries.
Ah, because it’s called [00:05:00] Mulberry, isn’t it? Mulberry, yeah. Yeah. And of course, Langhorne Creek, Bleasdale, isn’t it? Or McLaren Vale? It’s a Langhorne Creek. Langhorne Creek. Langhorne Creek. Yeah. ‘Cause that’s where we were last week- Hmm … uh, with the Bremerton wines, so bit of a theme. Just down the road from each other- Yeah
and, uh, similarities. And all delicious. Hmm. It is really beautiful wine. I’ve actually rudely just opened Andrew’s second bottle, but it’s because I- You did that without me noticing. Hmm. Oh, yeah. Oh, now I’ve just put my foot in it. Uh, it was funny- Well, don’t do that. It’s now probably began a slide. Um, this beautiful bygone era from McLaren Vale, this Shiraz, i- I mean, when I first put my nose in it, it was like I was holding rubber gloves.
I was holding the glass with rubber gloves. There was a rubber note that I got to it, but now it’s given- Ooh. Do you get that as well? Oh, I got that straightaway. Hmm. But now this- They’re promoting safe sex. Well then, oh, of a bygone era. Yes. It just moved me back to one more boring night in Adelaide with Redgum and their, uh, final, their final [00:06:00] song, Roll on Robbie.
Oh, is that- that was their last hit. It was all downhill from there, wasn’t it? Mm. This is gorgeous wine. This is very well-constructed. How did you come across this one? Just another one you like or- Um, no. Again, I stumbled across that by accident. It was, um, there were two bottles for, I think, a very good price.
Um, around about $30, I think, for the two, and they’re normally $60 for the two, so that’s why I purchased two bottles. I don’t know what happened to the other bottle. I’m sorry. Hmm. Well, it’s from a bygone era. Yeah, it was. Let’s put it in the past. Let’s put it behind us. Let’s put it behind. Let bygones be bygones.
Let bygones be begones. Yes. Let’s, let’s not dwell on it. What are you getting on the, what are you getting on the palate, Brett? It’s very, very broad on the palate, isn’t it? It’s the, it covers so many different tastes right across, right across your tongue. You can actually, every single bit, salt, um, sweet.
Yep. Uh, there’s some vanilla. Mm. There’s a hint of vanilla in it. I got [00:07:00] cherry as well after the rubber. Mm. But gee, it’s just drinking beautifully. Mm. And this certainly will open up as the night goes on. So what’s left for me to say at this point is the Bleasdale Mulberry Tree Cab Sav 2014 and the Bygone Era McLaren Vale Shiraz.
What year is this one? Two- 2014. 2014. The South Australian drinks of the week.
In items without notice this week, just two little recollections of, uh, the history of this podcast, which is three years old this week. And Brett, you’ve known me for a long time, and you know I’m not one that’s- Long time … very much given to tradition and ritual, at least I don’t believe I am. What’s fascinating about this is in thinking about this milestone, which is purely arbitrary [00:08:00] Uh, it actually is taking on deeper significance.
Now, what, how do you look at that from your background? ‘Cause you work in systems therapy, you’ve h- got a, uh, you’re Anglican priest as well, so you’ve got that other literary, uh, a- and theological background. What, how do you make sense of how something like this gives you pause for thought? It gives a sense of something being bigger than it necessarily is.
Well, I think there’s a number of things that’s really interesting in what you said. The fact that you, uh, don’t think that you actually, um, believe in, in ritual or, or ritualization when your day-to-day stuff is actually constantly ritual. You repeat yourself over and over again, as all of us do in our day-to-day things.
We get up in the morning usually in the same way. We have our breakfast in the same way. Um, if you, if you’ve listened to the last three years of the, um, Adelaide Show, some might accuse it of being the same show done- … um, for three years every week. But there’s, uh, [00:09:00] but the thing there is the, the significance is, is it’s got life.
It’s life that’s, that’s been lived, and it’s got its own life and lifestyle. It’s very different from anything else you’ve done in some ways, and very similar to everything you’ve done in others. And so for those three years, it’s taken on a life of its own. It’s taken on the life of every individual in it because every relationship, and this is coming down to obviously the, the family side of, or the, or the relationship side of it, every relationship creates a new reality.
And the, the show itself is a series of relationships that have, where people have joined, uh, they’ve come, they’ve gone, much like life and death, which of course Andrew- Mm … deals with quite regularly as well. Um, and, uh, and the show’s really a whole… I guess it’s a metaphor for life in some ways. It really- And three years is, is, and it’s only as, it’s only young, isn’t it?
It does. It still feels young, but it, it feels like it’s got its first tufts of hair- Mm … you know, that has to start shaving soon. Um- Well, note that some of the people involved in the Adelaide Show are over 50, [00:10:00] um- … uh, on that regular basis, so you bring 50 years of experience there, Steve, as well. So- Well, as I was writing this down, of course, we began this podcast under the, uh, title Another Boring Thursday Night in Adelaide.
Uh, we chose that title ’cause it was an ironic way to stare down people who just throw that title around willy-nilly, some- without thinking, or people looking for bravado by dumping on the city they’re in as a way to prove they’re better than where they are. I noticed you crossed your arms as I said that, Andrew.
What’s going through your mind as I bring this up? ‘Cause I know you preferred our old title to the Adelaide show. I remember th- that. I, yeah, simply crossed my arms because I wanted to cross my arms. There was nothing, n- no psychological bearing behind it at all, Steve. It sounds like- Do you like to talk about that?
I just found it interesting- Do you enjoy, like, to talk to about, talk about that? Oh, no, no. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, no, sorry. Go on. It’s interesting what you, you’ve just sp- what you were saying about, uh, ritual. [00:11:00] Just got me thinking as you were speaking. Just, it, I guess with the podcast, and I think it’s 156 episodes, not 157, that you’re talking about tonight.
This is the 157th. This is the… It is the 157th. So sorry, I got confused ’cause we were talking about it Sunday night, last Sunday night. Just before you continue- The 156th … can I give the background to that? Yeah. It’ll take t- one second. Yep, sure. Okay. Now, I thought last ye- last week would be the third ’cause it’s 52 weeks times three is 156.
Yeah. Surely that’s three years. No, not according to Mr. Scientist, Nigel Dobson-Keeffe. I’ll quote for you. Who, who hasn’t got a job when he gets back. Here’s, here’s the quote he sent me. “Steve, each year is 52 weeks plus one or two days. This year it’s two days, so you need to add four days on, which kicks it into the following week.
Four days after August 17. Just go by the date. Episode one was August 29th, so birthday is August 24th. Glad to be of service.” So just, can you just clarify my thoughts here? This information is coming from a guy who is [00:12:00] currently where? In, in, in a desert in the Amazon or? He’s in the California- California
about to head out into the desert to prance around with hippies. Looking at a fake sun- Yes … and fake planet circling this fake sun, which is afterwards, o- once it’s all done- It’s gonna burn … they’re gonna burn it. Yeah. So that information is from him. Thank you. It is true. Thank you. I would’ve let you get away with 152, 156, Steve.
Oh, thank you. Oh, Michael. But- We’ll talk after this. I think anniversaries, like most things, do we remember the actual arguments around when the actual turn of the, the millennium was. Yeah. Mm. Uh, because of the different possibilities of how you calculate c- calculate dates. Yes. Was it 2000 or was it 2001?
Mm. Is how it was split, wasn’t it? It was. It was. It was. No, it was the Adam that was split. And I think we’re having the same- It was the Adam that was split. The, the, the rituals and then it’s just interesting getting, getting back to rituals, how they’re, it’s… I, I think I’ve lost the train of thought, to be honest with you now.
Because, but, um, it’s just, [00:13:00] uh, we’re, it’s like Groundhog Day. We’re do- do- we’re practicing something over and over again- And it, it gives us a basis, it gives us a foundation to go on without … Now, I’m, no, no. Is it? I lost it. I lost, I had a- I think, I think, yeah actually, I think- It was brilliant but I’d looked at it- I think you’ve got it.
I’m- … about it before … I’m sorry we had so many asides, didn’t we there? We did. But I think there, there’s something in what you’re saying. I mean- Yeah. I’m not, I’m not- … it’s, you’re, you’re grabbing onto the idea that we, we constantly do repeat ourselves. And even, even if, you know, each segment of this session we’re doing, uh, Steve keeps pushing me against the microphone.
Um, and that’s, there’s a ritual to that. I- I’m not sure what the ritual is. Oh, well that’s stretching ritual a little bit though, isn’t it? If you’re repeating it in exactly the same way, it’s a ritual, isn’t it? And the same with the clapping before each section. I think everything has foundations. Mm.
Everything has foundations, and I guess we build on and a- and around those foundations, and that’s, I guess, the, well, the point I was trying to get to- Mm … uh, when, when it comes to rituals. And w- be it in the church, be it [00:14:00] in, uh, what we do in our daily lives, getting up, what you were talking about, Brad, earlier on.
It’s the foundations about well, what we do in order to function and then move on, and then we c- we always have that to come back to. Mm. Is ritual about comfort? Is there comfort in familiarity? So when you’re in those … You know, because we often have ritual around things that are distressing or highly emotional.
Mm. Is it because it provides that familiarity and comfort that we rely on ritual in those moments? I’m not sure it’s been that comforting to, uh, the virgins who were sacrificed as part of rituals in the past, but it’s certainly a good point, Michael. It’s funny, for the society, though- … it actually gave, um, it gave an assurance of whatever it was trying to do because most things like sacrifice especially- Yeah
was about bringing order out of chaos. Yeah. And so, yeah, those people obviously for certain parts of society wasn’t good. But, but ritual has to do with also our executive functioning. Our, our brain has to put together steps of things we do in a certain way, and it’s far easy for our body [00:15:00] and also for our, our, um, community to actually do things in step by step by step by step.
If we can get rid of actually having to use our, the, the f- yeah, our frontal lobe to actually work out what those steps are first, um, and, and, and so we don’t have to think about the order of things- We can just use the rest of our brain for the creativity of actually living that, experiencing it, doing it, rather than actually recreating altogether what you do.
And in my work with systems, that’s what we’re looking at, those patterns. So we take away the hassle. But there’s also purpose. Mm. There’s also purpose from the rituals. I also think there’s a safety blanket aspect to it, though, which is picking up on the comfort thing. Mm. When we’re on this planet at daytime, we still have all that horrible space out there that wants to kill us.
The moment we leave our atmosphere, everything will kill us beyond the safety of this little zone we live in. But the l- the sunlight comes in, it, it reflects off the atmosphere, it creates a lovely [00:16:00] blue sky, and we all– we can just go about. And to me, ritual is like that lovely blue sky we wrap around ourselves.
Without it We see what life can be really like. We see the full reality, the vastness- Mm … and we possibly get a bit lost in that, and this is a way of shrinking our perspective a bit. Yeah, I’d, I’d probably actually disagree entirely with that as where the comfort lies. Yes. I think the, the comfort actually lies more in the fact that, that our programmed bodies, our, our, the way our neurons work, the way our whole self works, is it’s easier, and in, in, in ease they’re safe.
We also know, and, and like from the concept of, of safety, um, we know if we do things in one way, we didn’t get hurt last time. Okay. We do it in the same way, we’re not, not hurt again. Mm. Which is why you’ll walk into a, a cafeteria, and you’ll usually try and go to the same chair that you went to last time.
Mm. So for me, how is, [00:17:00] how is ritual different to habit? Because some of the stuff you’re describing there sounds like habit, which- Yes … but I put ritual in a different category to habit. Ritual to me has a higher significance than simply something you do each day. Can’t argue with that. Brett will. Yeah, I will.
Yeah, good. I mean, what, what you’re talking about is- My, my, my, my, my first thought is habit is something nuns wear. Mm. That, that’s
really clever. Yeah. That’s funny ’cause that’s about cloister and ritualized, isn’t it? And if they’re crooked, they’re bad habits. There’s a few movies about that, I think. I, I saw, I, I, I saw The Sound of Music a couple of Fr- Friday nights ago, and there’s nothing crooked about those nuns, Michael, at all. The, the interesting thing is, is that we talk about bedtime rituals, don’t we, with our kids, and that’s exactly the same thing as, as habits, isn’t it?
I, so I’d put them together. Um, we do have greater rituals, though, that are actually about m- possibly the ones about the numinous and, and about life and [00:18:00] death and, and, uh, bonding and relationship and all those that are, that are more community habits rather than personal habits or community rituals rather than personal, uh, rituals.
I just want to use one word: reassurance. Out of rituals, out of those habits, everything is, is, is about that reassurance that we are in control of something in our lives through those rituals, and when everything goes wrong, we can come back to that. Mm. Now, on that note of reassurance, I, I agree. I think us having a theme song that we play each week on the show is, uh, similar to a ritual, isn’t it?
There’s the fact that we know that, ah, in my mind, I hear the theme. I, I know what I’m in for. I have that, I, I, I’m, I’m set up for it, and as it turned out, we actually started, uh, in episode one without a theme. We found, I found a bit of generic music that we, we were allowed to use legally, and Brett Monton, who was part of the original trio of myself, Colin, and Brett, he’s the muso, and he said, “I’ll come up with a theme next week.”
Well, it took about 11 weeks- … before we [00:19:00] actually got a theme. Uh, however, in fact, let’s have a listen. Here’s the first 40 seconds of episode number one.
And welcome to Another Boring Thursday Night in Adelaide, a podcast recorded in Adelaide for Adelaide, but not always about Adelaide. And no matter where you’re listening in, remember this: there’s a little piece of Adelaide in us all. I’m welcoming my fellow podcasters tonight, Mr. Colin Long. Hello, Steve.
Brett Monson. Hello, everyone. Hello, Steve. And myself, Steve Davis. Well, we are here, episode number one, the show without the theme, uh, which we should have soon, shouldn’t we, Mr. Music? Uh, yes, I’m working on it. I’ve got my head deep in GarageBand trying to fix something up. So yes, hopefully next week we shall have a theme.
Next week we should have a theme. Hopefully. Yes. That wasn’t much commitment there. [00:20:00] You’ll, you’ll be happy to know that through the week, um, Brett was clearing out files, and he found a theme that he had written that he had forgotten all about. He must have had a few bourbons one night, and he wrote a theme song for one more, uh, for Another Boring Thursday night in Adelaide before we’d really worked out as a team the level of irony we would apply to it.
Like, we really wanted it tongue-in-cheek so that no one could use it as a weapon against Adelaide. Uh, he hadn’t quite got that memo yet. And I thought, “He’ll kill me, but I can’t pass playing this.” So for the sake of history, here is the theme song that never was a theme song, uh, Brett Monson’s bourbon-inspired take on Another Boring Thursday Night in Adelaide.
Well, it’s one more boring Thursday night in Adelaide Seems like one [00:21:00] more boring Thursday night for me. It’s late night shopping in the suburbs. But after nine you’re out on your ass. There’s nothing to see ‘Cause it’s one more boring Thursday night in Adelaide It’s one more boring Thursday night indeed
One more boring Thursday night in Adelaide Yeah, it’s one more boring Thursday night for me Well, the cat’s looking at me strangely. Like, [00:22:00] “What the hell are you doing home?”
Did you see the cat? He came over from Sydney
He’s far from home ‘Cause it’s one more boring Thursday night, night Yeah, it’s one more boring Thursday night for me
It’s one more boring Thursday night in Adelaide And it’s one more boring Thursday night indeed
This is Sharon from Kyton’s Bakery, and you’re listening to the Adelaide Show, [00:23:00] best enjoyed with a lamington and a cup of tea. When I had a major birthday milestone this year, I asked a handful of close friends to come to dinner and to bring a eulogy for me. Mm. They were recorded in secret, and they’ve been edited by Michael to share in tonight’s program.
I have not heard them yet. You and I are going to hear them together for the first time tonight. Now, I asked them to do this because I have– I believe, actually, the closest we get to learning about what our lasting impact and memories will be within our communities and families is something that is primarily shared in eulogies, at which point it’s actually too late for us to get an inkling as to how much or little those around us valued us and our interactions with them.
I believe we should all write and record eulogies for our friends and present them at birthdays, and then update them as each year progresses. It would spark [00:24:00] deeper levels of conversation between us for most of us, and give us time to steer our ships back from danger or to forge on towards worthy treasures.
To discuss this tonight, I have Brett Williams, my longest-serving friend, who is a Anglican priest, but primarily now a systems family therapist. What’s– I always get that wrong. No, systems family therapy, yes. Is good. Uh, so family therapist is good. At Adelaide Night and Day Therapy, and Andrew Reimer, a radio buddy who is now also a sought-after celebrant.
Andrew. Thank you very much, Steve. I think what you’re referring to is interventions rather than eulogies. Maybe it’s that by another name. I think he’s actually made a, a great point there. He has. And we’re, we’re gonna tease that point. I wanna say formally, welcome, welcome- You’re squirming. What’s that about?
That’s the alumni today. Welcome, gentlemen, to my wake. Um, now- [00:25:00] Oh, that’s why the wine. Are you confident, you three, that you would know what friends would write in your eulogies? Well, the wonderful thing about eulogies, Steve, is- … they, they are written once, uh, a person has passed away because nobody likes to speak ill of the dead.
Have you been working on that all night? No, I haven’t. But it’s, it’s, you know, just our, our current conversation is making me reflect on that. Uh, actually, it’s probably a, uh, a long-held belief. Um, I think it’s something to do with my, my genes as well, and with conversations I’d have with my brothers, Wolfgang and Hans Joachim.
That’s just our very- So would you- I’m Andrew … are they still with us, your brothers? Yes, they are. Yes. What would they– Uh, do you have a sense of what they would write about you? You don’t have to tell us what they’d write, but do you have any sense what would come out of their mouths at your funeral? I can’t imagine them speaking at my funeral They’re just not the type of guys to speak at funerals.
Okay. [00:26:00] Yep, that’s it. It is a challenging thing. I, I, I’m, I’m, I’m not like the rest of my family, and the rest of the family’s not like me. Right. Yeah. If that makes sense. Are you curious as to what they’d be thinking at the funeral? No. Brett, what about you? Wha- if you think about people around you, are you pretty confident that you would know what would be in the eulogies?
They’d be lying. Just, just like to say that right now, so that, uh, just in case that happens at some point. Um, no, I’ve got no idea really what they’d say, because one of the things about your eulogy is that it’s very specific to that point in time. It’s very specific to the experience that, that the people who are writing it at that point in time are going through.
They may be recalling things from the past. They may be recalling something of their story with the person, but it is very, very much then and there. And it does, I think, I think Andrew’s quite right. I think people try very hard to say only positive things, and I’ve heard such [00:27:00] tripe said at so many of the funerals I’ve been at that, that, um, were some of the stuff made up to actually, uh, make the person look better than what they are or were- Mm
or, or the even the experience of the individuals, and having to know that they were actually made-up things. A little bit later, we’re gonna tease out the sort of content that makes for a good eulogy and, and experiences you two, in your different celebrancy roles have, uh, have come across. But are you curious as to what your friends would say about you this week?
Or not? I think I should have to write it actually. So no, no, I’m not overly curious. I think, um, that’s really about their, their experience at the time. Not curious at all? Not curious at all. Okay. We’ll come back to- I generally let people actually, because people’s thoughts are their thoughts, and thoughts are never facts, and I, and I, they change from moment to moment.
And, uh, I’m sure there’s people there. Hopefully, I’m not being, um, uh, th- that obviously there’s people around Adelaide talking about me right now. I’m not paranoid or anything, just, [00:28:00] uh I can just imagine Brett’s probably worked out the, the, the, the service sheet for his funeral, and there on the front is a slogan, “Opinions are not facts.”
Bear this in mind as you listen to the eulogies today. Well, you’re 90% right. Yeah. I had a question for Andrew. Yeah. Because I thought he- Hang on. Before you ask that question- Oh, okay … you haven’t answered the question. Oh, he spotted it. Are you confident that you know what your wife or close friends would write about you today?
Uh, I could have, I could have the, an idea about it, I think. I think I’d have a bit of an idea what they’d say, but no, I wouldn’t say I’m confident about it. Are you curious? No, I wouldn’t wanna know. I don’t wanna know. You don’t? No, I find that stuff really hard. Okay. Even when people talk about me.
Something I, that’s something I’m not good at is people talking about me or saying stuff about me. I don’t wanna hear it. Hmm. Good things or bad things? Oh, [00:29:00] anything. Anything. No, no, I don’t like it. I ha- I had a question for you, Andrew, based on– ’cause I thought you wriggled out a little bit back there. So who, who would- I wriggle out of things very well
yeah. So who would, if it wasn’t your brothers who would speak at your funeral, who would it be? Who do you think would deliver your eulogy? I’ve got no idea who, who’d be attending my funeral. I- Like if it was next week. If it was next week, I’ll be dead. I’m not gonna care. I’m seriously not gonna care. And the thing is, too, th- th- so many different people have passed through my life.
I, I look back, so I’m 52 years old now, and I look at the relationships and I’ve, uh, had, and people have come and gone throughout my life. I don’t know who’s gonna get up and speak at the end of the day. I’m not sure who’d want to get up and speak. I’d like to think they would focus on the positive contributions I’ve made in my life.
Mm. I’d like to think that would happen, and I imagine that’s what would happen. But each and every body- I’d like to go to that service ’cause it’ll be nice and short.[00:30:00]
But I, uh- They’re even, huh? Oh, that’s- Well, I’m nothing like it. Touche, touche, touche. The, um, yeah, I, I, I, I guess I’d like to pe- yeah, um, I think people capture different parts of you at different parts of your, of their lives, and that will be their perception of you, and that’s what will remain with them.
Mm. Mm. So for different people, it’s gonna be different things. Can, can I actually ask something? Steve, you haven’t answered the question yourself. What, who would be speaking at, um… And, and given that you organized the ones that- Yes … that have organ- uh, uh, have happened, they wouldn’t necessarily be the ones that would happen at your funeral.
Who do you think would speak at your funeral, um, and what do you think they would say? And given that you’re gonna hear some of the things of some of the people that may be speaking at your funeral- Yeah … tell us what they’re s- they’re going to say, Steve. Well, I- Wow, that’s interesting. I think- Put you [00:31:00] back on the spot really, didn’t it?
Okay. Well, there are five eulogies we’ll be listening to tonight. The first one we’ll be hearing is by you, Brett, and I’m anticipating that people will squirm in their seats because you will share some really raw and embarrassing stories of my youth and adulthood. Uh, and look, you might remember one or two things I did along the way that weren’t too bad.
That, that seemed to have some positive impact, I’m, I’m thinking. I don’t know. Mm. That’s just a guess. Michael’s is next. Um, I think Michael might talk about the theater, uh, and meeting him through the theater. That’s what I’m, I’m thinking he might say, and he might overlook the fact that I was a, a, a gangly, overly self-conscious actor who fumbled about on the stage but had a great time doing it.
Uh, and but I tried. I would’ve said, I would’ve said Romeo was actually more the word that would be used for that. Um, so there was that. Uh, Simon Butters, when you get to hear him, I also met him through theater. [00:32:00] I’m curious to know what Simon will say. We played squash together a lot. We, um- Oh, we did a lot of acting Steve, can you just get closer to the mic, please?
Yes. Um, so I, I actually- Of, of all of them, Simon’s the, the dark horse. I’m not sure what he’d say. Adam Claridge, I met him, uh, in my acting days as well in a, in a past life, and I think he might chip on a little bit about my n- my nature. Uh, maybe, uh, we’ve had lots of long conversations together that were, uh, interesting times in our different lives.
I actually don’t know. I’m a little bit nervous. And then Nigel Dobson-Keay, who’s known me the, the least amount of time, but has worked with me really closely under pressure. Hmm. I’d be curious to know what he says what it’s like working with me doing this podcast, and what he thinks about my complete lack of [00:33:00] skill in doing anything physical around the house-
uh, and r- and relying on him. Mm. So that’d be interesting. So th- and they’re the ones who are… Apart from my wife, who I- Mm. I was just gonna ask that … I didn’t subject her to this, um, challenge. Um, what would she say? I think post the Dr. Gemma Munro interview, I think there’d be much more positive things that she’d have to say.
Um, and then she might comment on, uh, some of the, the things, the magic that’s happened with the girls, with the kids. Mm. That’s a guess Along the way Well, maybe overall, a job well done, Steve Yeah. Uh- Is what she might say Oh, that’s what she might say? Mm. Well, I don’t know. Uh, that remains to be seen, but from now on, no one ask me the question.
Yeah, yeah. It was actually quite, quite nice to see the fear in his eyes. Well done, Brad. Yeah, be- b- ‘Cause I’m about to find out if that’s true or not- Yeah. Mm … as we go through. But can I, yeah, b- just point out, too, uh, [00:34:00] traditionally, Australians aren’t very good public speakers as well. Mm. They don’t like getting up in front of a crowd, and it’s very hard to find somebody, quite often, who is prepared to do a eulogy at a funeral because they don’t like public speaking, and they’re worried because of the relationship with the deceased- Mm
th- they’re gonna lose it, and they don’t wanna be seen in that vulnerable position. It’s, it’s absolutely interesting. Uh, uh, what I’ve noticed over the years in, in secular funerals, you know, non-religious ones, I, I think, I find that to be, be very, very true that, uh, so many I’ve been to and so many I’ve been involved in, it’s very hard to get someone to speak.
But in the religious ones, um, it’s very, very– We find it y- very, very easy to get someone to get up and speak, and I don’t know what the difference is, and it might have something to do with there being a community that you’re specifically linked to, but it is a, it is a, a marked difference. And, um, and I’ve gotta say one of the things that, that I find disappointing about some of the secular funerals I go to is that you hear the one voice the whole way through, the one person, which is the [00:35:00] celebrant, and, uh, and who is very clear has never met the person before- Mm
as well. Um- That hasn’t been my experience with secular funerals, though. Mm. I mean, you probably have been to more than I have been to. Mm. But I mean, I went to Glenn Gale’s recently, and there was a, a myriad of voices that- I think we’re talking about someone who’s relatively famous, so. Hm. Mm. Okay. Uh. All right.
My question that I wanted to follow up my opening question with is this one: In this era in which the smartphone is welded to many of our palms, and I heard someone make the quip today that we have given up the moments of silence for silent interactions with others through this device- And also, other people argue that it’s narcissism writ large.
We, uh, we, we, we use this as a spotlight on our lives, and it’s us, us, us, me, me, me the whole time. My question is, do you think this exercise of [00:36:00] me being curious to hear what people would say in a eulogy, is that narcissistic of me? I think it’s a rhetorical question you’re asking. As I choking on my cheese.
Yes. I’m, I’m curious. Uh, would you, would… It probably is, isn’t it? I, I suspect possibly there may be, and the fact you wanna do a r- uh, a podcast about it and, and- Well- … you’d really like to know what people would say that are the good words, you know, the, you know- Or bad. I’m- Well, it’s eulogies. It’s about well, well words or good words.
That’s, um, which is the, the Greek of it. Except although that’s probably in the mix, I can’t dodge that. I’m also thinking I wanted to talk about eulogies, funerals, et cetera. Yeah. And why not make myself the guinea pig? So there was that side of it as well. There was the side of, hey, you know, I, I subject myself to any topic we’re onto each week.
Mm. Well, if you’re really serious about this, let’s see you really suffer for your art. All right. It was, it was also, it was, you know, [00:37:00] um, was it Oscar Wilde who said, you know, as long as somebody’s speaking about me, I can’t remember the quote exactly. He said, “There’s only one thing worse than being talked about is not being talked about.”
Thank you. I live my life by that motto. Oh. So does that mean there’s paranoia around it, though- … worrying about what other people are saying at any point? Well, uh, I’m just, I’m just curious. I d- okay, I’m, I’m gonna move on from that question. I think, no, I think it’s the- That was a beautiful answer, though … I think it’s actually the nature of the beast.
Uh, the fact that you are involved, well, you’ve b- b- been involved with the theater, the media. You’re about putting yourself out there. You want to be… and most people, I would say, as a generalization, within, in the media, they want, they seek, uh, reassurance. They seek, uh, uh, acceptance from the greater community, and it’s, uh, affirmations, reaffirmations that I’m okay, and that’s what you’re doing.
That’s what each and every one of us who, who does- Mm … pretty much in every way of life is we’re, we’re seeking that, um reassurance that we were okay. And that’s exactly what you’re doing now, which is quite normal I, I think you, you [00:38:00] picked a, a really good point. I mean, all human beings need to know that they’re loved, they’re worthwhile, um, that they actually have a purpose and a place in, in other people’s lives and in, in, in the world, whether they’re an introvert, an extrovert.
Mm-hmm. And performers can be both introverts or extroverts. Interesting enough, a lot of performers are actually introverts- Yep … who actually get more energy from being alone than they do from being, being in company. Yet, yet also there’s this other side that might be an extrovert side that actually says they need a huge amount of people around them saying that they’re worthwhile.
Um, and it’s just, that’s what they do as performers. And, and they need those people that they’re performing to, to say that they are worthwhile. And, and I think it’s a f- I don’t think that makes you narcissistic, it’s just part of the beast of being out there as, as, uh, Andrew says. I think what it is more so, and I’m, I’m not a psychologist by any stretch of the imagination, but I’m sure if I was, I could have some fun with you, Steve.
Um- I think, uh, you talk about the fact that it was a, a [00:39:00] milestone that you recently achieved- Mm … okay? Which I wasn’t invited to. Um- Because you were on air. Could have asked. Let’s talk about his security right at this point in time, uh, on both sides. I, I think it’s, I, I think, uh, you’ve, you’ve, you’ve come to a point, you’ve come to a milestone in your life, and I guess what you’re currently seeking now is, um, the, the reassurance that you’re on the right track for the next stage of your life.
What you’ve achieved so far, you want reassurance that it’s valued, that you’re on the right track, that you’re doing the right thing, not only by those you love, but through this podcast and the other, the work you do, the greater community. And so it’s just, you wanna know that, “Okay, I’m, I’ve achieved what I wanted to at this part of my life, so I can now move on to the next part of my life and that next part of my journey.”
I, y- I think it’s two sides of a coin. You’ve named one side of it. The other [00:40:00] side that’s just as valid, that was a driver for me doing this, is I was really curious about what was not talked about, about what gets omitted from these eulogies we’re about to hear, uh, or, or anything on the negative side. But so more so the, the omissions of things where I think maybe- That hasn’t been recognized or valued or was wrong, and it gives me time to correct.
I’ve got the time to correct the course now and, and go, “You know what? Wow, look at this picture I’m seeing. How one-dimensional is that? I’ve got to fill in the blanks now, and I’ve got some direction.” Hmm. See, that’s different from, that’s different from eulogies, though. That’s more your epitaph. That’s the words over your, your body, the, the ones where, where someone says those last words over your grave.
And, and epitaphs or epitaph logos, I think they were called, which are the Greek. They, they come from the Greek tradition. That’s more about actually [00:41:00] saying, um, where you fit into the bigger picture and, um, and maybe those, those laments ’cause they were often laments of a form, whereas eulogies are actually supposed to be positive and, and, uh- So I might mix them anyway
yeah. So it’s an interesting difference that we make, and people do mix them, but you often don’t get the negatives at funerals. Right. What I’m picking up here is the year 1988, Bill Murray- Yes … and the movie Scrooged. I’ve never seen it. Hmm. Hmm. Okay. That’s brilliant. The, the Ghost of Christmas- Yeah … Past, the Ghost of Christmas Present, the Ghost of Christmas Future- Mm
being visited. Scrooge, the old- Hmm … Charles Dickens. Yeah, I’m aware of that one. Okay. Yep, yep. Yep. So that’s r- I think where you’re at. Yeah. I’m, I’m, I’m, I’m wanting to see. You, yeah. I wanna learn from… I, I’m really looking at what Christmas Future is, and I’ve got time to change it. Mm-hmm. Hmm. Sorry. I, I was just gonna say that we, we might actually start with something that, that seems to be very central here, and that has to do with, [00:42:00] um, how important we are in the world.
And I just wanted to say three phrases that all parents should be saying to their children every night in a ritualized fashion so that it actually helps with the programming of the brain, and it’s also good to say to your partner every day at the same time as well. And that’s three very, very basic phrases.
And, uh, and they come to me. They’re, they’re used very generally around the, the spot in family therapy and in, in relationship counseling. Uh, and, and these specific phrases are put in a way by a, a psychologist known as Sandy Litt, and, uh, who I, I have, uh, repurposed them from. He’s Adelaide-based, isn’t he?
He’s, he’s actually Glenelg-based, too. He’s around the corner from me. Glenelg, just near us in Brighton. Yeah, Glenelg Psychology. In, hence the name Sandy, by the beach. Oh, boom, boom. That’s very clever. Yeah. And, uh, Stephen, I’d like you to look in my eyes- Another dad joke … and I’ll just say, say these three phrases.
S- Stephen, I love you. You are worthwhile. You’re the friend I’ve always wanted [00:43:00] Wow And, and that might actually answer the angst, the existential angst that seems to be actually flowing through some of the questions maybe. That’s a lot easier than a podcast.
Oh, that was, that was beautiful. Um, so are you suggesting that as we put our girls to bed, we make sure we look them in the eye and we say that every night- Mm … even if they know what we’re going to say? Yep. And they, and, and kids find it irritating. They find it funny. They’ll squirm out of it, but, but you’re actually saying they have worth.
So I love you. That they’re loved. I love you. You are worthwhile. You are worthwhile. You’re the child I’ve always wanted. You’re the child I’ve- So they know they’re wanted. ‘Cause one of the things we often say is that in the Australian, that Australian, um, uh, what were you saying before, Andrew, about the Australian psyche and we’re, we’re not good at public speaking, but there’s other- Not good at public speaking, not a good at expressing ourselves, um, emotion.
Mm. We’re, we’re just not good at it. Mm. We’re just, [00:44:00] we’re, uh, the old stiff upper lip and all that sort of business, and it’s not cool to cry. It’s not, uh, cool to, to tell somebody you love them, and that’s where guys fall down a lot in relationships because they’re not able to express their emotions the way you just did to Steve.
And I think that was beautiful the way you did that. Thank you. I was just waiting for Steve to, uh, reply with the, “I love where your hands are.” Well, I thought I’d hid them well at that point in time, but- You can edit that out. Nothing, nothing gets edited. Nothing gets edited. No. So, so yes, I think say it to each other because there’s another thing here is that it may be the very last time you can ever say that to them.
Yeah. One, one of the things that happened on the night of doing the, the eulogies is that in the morning of that day, um, Steve sent a, uh, a social media post that was supposedly from his wife, Nadia, and, uh, that said, “Look, I’m sorry to, to inform you guys, but, uh, Steve actually died this morning.” Now, I’ve been [00:45:00] expecting Steve to die of a heart attack for quite a while, and, um, and, and that will happen to, to the best of us.
Uh, but I can tell you at that point in time while reading it, most of the people I think who read it actually realized it was a joke straight away. Mm. I didn’t. I didn’t either. You didn’t either? No. You had the same response then, did you? Uh, no, not quite. I’m gonna ask that, I’m gonna ask that of my wife.
Hallelujah, hallelujah, hallelujah. You know what Michael did? He got on the phone to Nigel straight away and said, “Hey, do you wanna do the podcast?”
Yes. Mine, mine was one of, of grief, loss, shock- Mm … horror, sort of half knowing that it’s gotta be a joke, but that’s part of the denial thing anyway. You go straight into denial. But, but I, I reckon it took me the rest of the day to, to breathe normally again. It was- And I apologize for that. I didn’t realize- Yeah
at the time- That’s all … that it would be the case. But it actually leads me [00:46:00] perfectly to what I wanted to ask next, which was what did it feel like? This is for Michael and Brett ’cause Andrew Rymer was working on air this night, so couldn’t be at this event. I, I do have something to add, Dave. Yeah. Because if…
I know this is about you, Steve. Uh, but, um, going back a few months ago, there was another, um, radio person down in Tasmania who’s also by the name of Andrew Rymer. Mm. Spelt exactly the same way as my name is. He did pass away, and the media grabbed it and put the obituary in saying that Andrew Rymer had passed away.
And the reaction was quite interesting because the program director got a phone call from the general manager saying, “Were you aware of this?” And he was like, “I didn’t even know he was sick.” And, uh, but the- Well, that kind of sick. That, that- Oh, that’s it. And, um, uh, my, my brother Hans Joachim, his partner [00:47:00] Kerry, she was on social media, and she turned around to him, he was watching TV, and, uh, she said, “Uh, Hans, have you spoken to your brother-” “Andrew lately?”
And he’s big, my brother Hans, he said, “No.” And she said, “Hmm, maybe you should give him a ring.” He said, “Why?” She said, “Well, because it’s got here that he’s dead.” So, and that sort of quite a few … I got quite a bit of, uh, interesting reaction to that, and I ha- ended up having to write to the journalist and saying, “Excuse me, I think you made a mistake.
You need to maybe check your facts a little bit better.” I’m Andrew Reimer, who was a radio announcer in Adelaide as opposed to the guy who was in, in Tasmania. Wow. But it just … What, what are the chances of that? I know. To, to be Andrew Reimer, R-E-I-M-E-R. That led to a really busy weekend. I had to redo my CV, send it to the FAAA manager and apply for the weekend nights job.
But, uh, all to no [00:48:00] avail. Did you get it? No. A- anyway, ba- basically, and, and that, that just reinforced Yeah, so. Yeah, look, when, when I say, you know, you talk about the, what my brothers might say at my funeral, that was, it was- Yeah … not necessarily a close family. If there’s a major drama, if there’s a major drama, we’d be there for each other.
But aside from that, I think we’ve been brought up to be fairly independent. Mm. So I, I, I really … When I die, I don’t know what’s gonna happen. It’s gonna be out of my hands. Yeah. So. Back to you boys, Michael and Brett. What did it feel like being asked to write a eulogy? ‘Cause as we just heard from Andrew’s anecdote, his brother might have been thrust into the spotlight then and have to either decide to do it or not do it and pass the buck or whatever.
Um, but that would’ve been upon him for that week, and he would’ve had a chance to, you know, get together, fly over for the funeral, wherever they are, et cetera. You two, you had a chance to work towards this to, to a date, but what was it like? I didn’t like it at [00:49:00] all. Why? Why? No, I don’t know. Well, I think I’m one of those people, but I, uh, you know, that you’re describing that would not get up and do a, deliver a eulogy.
I wouldn’t. But it’s not because I’m afraid of emotion. It’s more because I don’t actually feel a need to share it. You know, for me, it’s actually more of a private thing. You know, I’ve been to a lot of funerals, and I personally don’t get a lot out of going to funerals. Uh, so for me, I think it would be more It’s more about just…
It’s more of a personal private recollection for me, and it’s actually quite hard for me to externalize that because I don’t feel like anything I could do would do it justice. Mm. Mm. So it feels to me like whatever I did would be a failure in my own mind. It’s not a fear of speaking in public or anything, it’s just that I, I don’t feel like I could do justice to a person’s life- Mm
by writing a [00:50:00] eulogy. For me, it’s more about personal reflection. Mm. So I didn’t like it being forced into that position, especially with a two-minute time limit. Yes. Not that everybody got that message. But you’re also, in the back of your mind, let’s be honest, you know that Steve is alive and he’s gonna be- Yeah
judging you by that. “Ah, so that’s what he said. Ah, so that’s what you think about me.” So- It could be a long drive home tonight. … there is that account- that, that accountability as well. Yes. Mm. It’s an interesting thought ’cause I didn’t have that thought at all in terms of the accountability. Sure you did.
Mine was, uh, more that, um, what could I say that’s… Given his wife was going to hear it, what could I say, get away with? And, and I took it very seriously thinking, uh, he actually wanted a eulogy. I didn’t get sent the two-minute thing until I think the day before, and I’d already written it. Uh, my… I prepare things because I’ve got a, got a schedule of my day or else I can’t get things done.
So that’s again ritual and systemization and, and so on. So I had mine written well and truly before I got the two-minute thing, and, uh, and that was really at the last minute. [00:51:00] So I thought, “Okay, if, if I was doing this for real, what would I put in there?” Yeah. And, uh, and I thought about what would I need to do.
And what I found out is Steve just wanted people to actually say how much they loved him and, and all the beautiful things. Whereas I thought, okay, when you’re writing a eulogy, it’s actually about all the people that are out there, and, and there’s no point just telling your stories. If you’re the only one that’s got the chance to write it, you’ve got to write something that people can hang their stories on, so they can think about their time with Steve.
And, uh, and they… So I wrote it like that I wrote it not about my story with you, except for a few little, um, sidelines that, that questioned your sexuality. But, um, yeah, a lot of it was actually about – I knew they’d be
Yeah. Do we stop there, Dan? No, no. [00:52:00] Awkward. Awkward. Lean into discomfort. Lean in. Yes. Don’t bring out the Irish accent. And, and a number of other things that, you know, were, were uniquely Steve, and, and, uh, and that people could hang- Mm. You know, people could hang their own memories on. So I took it as a very serious- Right
serious thing. You know, then we got to the, the night and found that all Steve wanted us to say was actually what we found beautiful about him. No, I did not say that. Which, which, which, you know, there are so many beautiful things that, um, that, uh, well, we said all night anyway, and, uh, because you are such a beautiful person.
Yes. And I think, I think you- … you need to accept that, that you are. That’s true. Uh, you, you, you… This is beautiful. This is exactly going almost as I anticipated. Because this is- The night is young. This is the, this is the time where I swing my question to Andrew and- You use the word swing just after Brett has questioned your sexuality.
[00:53:00] Okay. So Brett and Andrew, who are practicing celebrants. What would you consider? You’ve, you’ve been involved in numerous funerals. Yes. What are the dos and what are the don’ts if someone listening to this show has to write a eulogy this coming week? What guide, what can you give them as a guide? First, my personal experience, and going from what Brett was talking about, the, uh, s- some of the, um, the poetic license which is taken with people’s lives.
First thing you, the best thing you can do is keep it real. Mm. You, you’re paying respect to a person’s life. Are we allowed to swear? Yep. Mm. Don’t bullshit. Don’t bullshit. Don’t make them sound to be an ogre, if indeed they were. They may have been an ogre. But, but by the same token, you know, you don’t have to point that out.
But, uh, keep it real. Okay, everybody has failings. Each and everybody has failings. So [00:54:00] not, not focus on those failings, but focus on the positives, and talk about the trials, the struggles that that person may have had, but talk about what was great, what was positive in their lives. ‘Cause at the end of the day, that’s what we wanna hold onto.
That’s what matters. That’s why we all, we all stuff up, but we wanna be remembered for the good things we did. Because I don’t believe many people intentionally stuff up. It’s, they just do it because they’re m- m- for, for whatever reasons, because of circumstance. And your don’ts, what would you avoid putting in, I suppose the reverse of what you just said.
Don’t put fluff up there. Don’t, don’t, don’t, don’t waffle. Uh, be prepared. Make sure whoever is speaking, uh … I, I, I think you really need the permission of the family, uh, to, uh, get whoever’s, the, the person who is speaking to speak. You need their okay that they’re gonna be a- all right. You don’t want too many speakers because at the end of the day, going on what you were [00:55:00] saying before, Michael, about funerals, you don’t like funerals, you don’t like writing eulogies.
Nobody does, because at the end of the day, what we’re talking about is something here in our society we don’t wanna face, and that is we are all going to die. We don’t like to face that. Mm. When it comes to funerals- Mm … we wanna get in there, have the service, get out, say, “It was a beautiful service,” share a cup of tea or coffee with somebody, maybe a drink or two.
Mm. Catch up with old, some old friends. Think, “Thank God it’s not me yet,” and get the hell out of there. That’s my own personal feeling. Mm. Mm. I think you’ve hit the nail on the head, and yet when someone does say, “Hey, I’m gonna die, so write a eulogy for me,” I get told I’m a narcissist. Anyway, Brett, how do you- That’s ’cause you’re still alive.
Did you actually get told that or do you just believe that? Um, we’ll listen back to the tape . Brett, what are your dos and don’ts? Um, main thing is, is not, a, a lot of the same things as, as Andrew. Um, I guess, uh, one of the [00:56:00] things is, that I start with is, is the amount of time, what you actually put in there.
Uh, it’s not a self-indulgent time to actually, um, talk about yourself, which a lot of people do do, and that can be quite, that can be just draining. You’ve, uh, if you go over 20 minutes of eulogies, you’ve, you’ve, you’ve just turned everybody off. People can cope with up to there. Best if they’re 10 minutes at the most, I think.
How long was Brett’s, Michael? 12 minutes. Okay. Mm. So that was ’cause I added a bit- It was nine … I actually added a bit too, because of the fact that I knew he wanted to actually blow it, yeah . All right. So No, it was nine minutes. Not too, about 10, 10-ish minutes. 10, 10 minutes overall, yep, for, for the total of all of them.
Not lots of self-indulgence- Yeah … not I, I, I. Yeah, so it’s not about, about me. It’s about actually who the person was, and, and it c- be those very personal things, and I think there’s two elements to it. One is the historical detail, because people attach their own memories to certain historical events, you know, births, weddings, family, [00:57:00] uh, uh, other events through work maybe, or whatever it is the people thinks did, did in their life, you know, their, their cricket club or, or in your case, you know, maybe La Mama Theatre and, and those.
They were fairly poignant moments where you connected with a lot of different people- Yeah … who would likely to be at your funeral. So they’ll remember those times, so you give them those, those h- hooks because you can’t give, like Michael said, you can’t do justice to someone’s life in 10 minutes. You, um, you…
And, and the eulogy isn’t the whole funeral service. There are other elements to a funeral service as well of what you’re doing there that tell the rest of the story, but this is about the past, the experience of what was and what, and almost to the point of what is right at this point with the, of the relationship with that person.
So we look for their story to be told- Mm-hmm … in a very succinct and poignant way. So what’s the don’ts? What are the don’ts? Well, the don’ts are don’t, don’t self-indulge. Right. It’s, that’s not your time. It’s actually everybody else’s time and, and the dead, the [00:58:00] ceased time, I think is the big don’t. Uh, i- it’s different from, uh, wedding, wedding best man speeches-
where they can, they tell all kinds of nasty, dirty stories often and, and can be just completely dreadful. Yeah, so, so don’t tell the dirt, I think is part of it- Yeah. Yeah … ’cause nobody needs to know. And if you do, tell it later wards, ’cause, ’cause those stories are fun at the wake and, uh- Mm … the other parts of it.
Right. So storytelling can happen a lot of times. Keep it real and respect. Yeah. How many people should get up and read a eulogy at a funeral? Personally And who should it be? Well, I, I, I, as a general rule, I really want to get the family involved because as, as Brett alluded to earlier on, when it comes to celebrants such as myself, we don’t really know the family.
Yeah. Okay? So, uh, we can get a bit of an idea about who the, the, the person who’s passed away is, and, uh, by the, the, the memories and often very different [00:59:00] memories of that person from, uh, various members of the family and their friends, but we don’t know who the essence of that person is. So I certainly encourage, uh, a family member to give the eulogy itself.
Um, I give a brief overview about the person, their essence, their, their, their, their strengths, their perhaps their, um, not failings, but their, their, their struggles, the- Their quirks … their quirks. That’s a very good word. Mm. And, um, then, um, I’d probably- As a general rule, my personal feeling, I like to keep it pretty short, as far as the whole service is concerned, contained to around about the 30-minute mark.
Mm. Um, a- Yep … and so probably, maybe two, maybe three people getting up and speaking at the most. At the most. Brad, do you concur or you got different opinion? Yeah, I reckon, reckon, um, usually, um, three at the absolute most. I’d look for one or two. Um, uh, and they don’t need to be great, [01:00:00] great public speakers.
They just need to be someone who’s real and can keep it real for the family. Um, even better if they can actually show emotion while they’re doing it, because that gives permission to everybody while they’re, they’re there. On that note, uh, what do we do if someone breaks down and starts crying or chokes up and can’t speak?
Uh, the one I was at, uh, for Glen Gale, the celebrant came over with a box- Mm … of tissues, and they were passed, but are there any tricks? I mean, I know you at the beginning of this interview alluded to the difference between- Mm … secular weddings and, uh, weddings from a, within a- Weddings? … a group. Uh, uh, sorry, funerals-
uh, within a group- Mm … uh, that could be s- in the mix, but are there any, is there any stagecraft? M- Michael might even have thoughts about- Mm … stagecraft because ironically, in the world of theater, to break character is to corpse. Mm. Mm. Uh, but so- Because the character dies. Mm. But, uh, I- The- … I want this advice as well because part of my dislike of eulogies is that in the [01:01:00] past I’ve had to get up at funerals and say things, and I haven’t been able to get a word out ’cause I’ve just been blubbering.
So I don’t have the answer to that. I am, again, it gets a little bit back. Yeah, you’re, you’re, um, um, breaking your, your role, so to speak, but I believe in keeping it real. And there’s been cases, and it’s about, it’s about empathy for the family. It’s about compassion. At the end of the day, we, we are human beings, yes.
Mm. Uh, uh, to all intents and purposes, it’s a, a bit of a, a performance going on, but it’s to do with, uh, emotions, very raw emotions, and you have to acknowledge those, uh, uh, uh, emotions and step in and be a real person. Mm. There was a funeral I did recently, and there was one of the family members giving a eulogy, and at the, the front, at the front of the, um- The, I, I want to say congregation.
I should’ve been a priest as well, Brad . Uh, and you’ve got the voice for it, I think, true . Well, I, I, [01:02:00] I’m, I’m digressing a little bit, but I would’ve loved to be one of those evangelical priests. “You will burn in hell, boy!” So I am, I am digressing. Uh- It’s good to turn people off you, but yeah, good . Uh, but this woman, all of a sudden, she started coughing.
She got something in her throat, and she started coughing, and nobody took any notice of the cough. And I was watching, and it progressively got worse, and it was like she was choking. And the husband, they were elderly, it was an elderly, um, group of people at the funeral, and nothing was being done, and this woman was going bright red, and she looked like she was in trouble.
So while the eulogy was on, I simply … There was a glass of water underneath the lectern. I grabbed the glass of water, which was mine, walked over, knelt down next to her, patted her on, on the knee, gave her the glass of water- Mm … calmed her down, and then I went back behind the, the person who was giving the eulogy.
And, uh, nobody [01:03:00] said anything. Nobody, uh, um, I, I suppose criticized it because how could you? How could you? I was there. I, I broke out of character- Mm … but I did so for a very valid reason. Somebody was in distress, and so that’s it. It gets- Yeah. Again, it’s back to keeping it real. Yeah. Exactly. And it’s, I think it’s okay to be real like that, and I think- Yeah
it’s fairly important. Um, it’s, it’s interesting, though, with, uh, actual people’s emotions during, during eulogies. The, uh, I think it’s a beautiful gift when people are crying because the permission it gives to, uh, others to cry. The other thing is it just doesn’t matter. Who cares? So the thing I do before, I actually, um, set people up beforehand.
I get them to, I always say, “Print it out- ‘Cause then, then, um, and, and follow your finger along while you’re actually doing it, ’cause then you can leave your finger there, and if you cannot continue, I can take over from that point. Wow. Okay. I think that’s only [01:04:00] ever, uh, over, you know, 400, 500 funerals, I reckon, um, I’ve done it once where I’ve taken over.
Um, uh, and that was very, very specific in its thing. The rest of it is you actually say, “Breathe,” so give permission to breathe. Tell people that they’re likely to break down, that there’s a possibility, ’cause they don’t know what emotions are likely to happen, and that’s okay. You’re allowed to do that. Um, once you give them permission, people actually get through it.
Mm-hmm. What I love, the ultimate irony of people worrying about what other people might think is there’s someone’s body next to you showing you how we all turn back to dust before too long. It doesn’t matter. Mm. And yet we’re s- We’re, we’re so trapped in the foibles and worries of our small worlds, our society, that it’s like, it’s almost like a straitjacket on us.
It’s the great leveler. Isn’t it? It’s the great leveler, and you’re absolutely right, Steve. You’re absolutely right. Now, uh, [01:05:00] two other quick things before we listen to the eulogies that have been prepared. Um, the eulogy itself, for the person who’s writing it and more than likely the person who then presents it, how in…
wh- what role does that play in their grieving process? Uh, is it, is it a poison chalice you should try and pass on, or is it a gift being, uh, uh, being asked to produce a eulogy? One of the, the things I think about that is, um, the whole funeral process is part of the grieving process. It’s about coming– It’s about denial.
It’s about, um, despair and, and, and, uh, um, uh, disillusionment. It’s about bargaining. It’s about anger. It’s about acceptance. It’s about all those different parts of the, of the grieving, grieving cycle. And so I think it’s, uh, helping people write one, telling people to actually use those around them ’cause [01:06:00] what, what…
There’s two different things that happens. One, where whole families want to actually put in everything they can. Yeah. And I think do- if they do it communally, that’s actually the best possible thing to do. But often, most people wanna do is just write their own. They’ll write one, and they’ll write from their perspective- Yeah
one thing, but how do you actually encapsulate the story of a human’s life, um, in one person? If I just said, “Steve, you write,” I know it’ll be very different from if I ask, say, Patrick to write one. Mm-hmm. Or if I ask somebody else to write one. It’s actually about a, a community writing one and maybe getting the part of their story heard that needs to be actually said, uh, publicly.
‘Cause the other thing that we sometimes need to do with funerals, and this isn’t part of the eulogy, but, but the eulogy comes into it, and that is actually forgiving what wasn’t done, forgiving what we didn’t do for the person, forgiving what the person didn’t do for us, um, and that comes into part of it as well.
And especially [01:07:00] when we don’t do something for them, this is a chance to do the last thing. Wow. And that’s why, why being asked to do anything in someone’s last part of their life is a gift, I think, because you can do the last thing you can in this earthly life for them, no matter what you believe about the future of life with them.
Hear, hear. Mm-hmm. That’s the shortest answer I think But that’s good. You nailed it. Yeah, absolutely. I think it was wonderful. Wonderful. Michael, any thoughts? Uh, I don’t, I don’t feel the need for it personally. Maybe I’m in complete self-denial, but I am j- I think I’m a reflective person, and so for me It, uh, it just doesn’t do it for me.
You know, the, even the whole funeral thing. So for me it’s more about I would rather have a day on my own- Mm … and go and sit on a beach somewhere- Mm-hmm … or sit on a hill somewhere- Yep, yep … and reflect. For me, that would be- Mm … a funeral, to give the person [01:08:00] that day of my life, rather than feeling the need to share it with others.
Are, are you allowed to do that? In what way? What do you mean? Are you allowed to do that? Say, I don’t wanna be part of the funeral. I don’t want to be there. I want to actually go and give a day of my life t- as a, as a gift to that person and me and our, and honor our relationship that way. Well, I mean, technically you’re allowed to do it, but I think, you know, thinking if it was my family, you know, say it was one of my parents that died, I’m not sure that everyone would understand that absence.
You know? I would, I would have a fear that it might cause a rift because people might misunderstand that, and that then it… So I would attend- Mm … out of fear of perhaps putting someone else’s nose out of joint. Mm. Again, the great folly. Yeah. Because there’s someone lying there for whom they don’t care anymore.
No, no. Um, but it does bring up a point I’ll make in a moment. Andrew Rhyme has got- The w- [01:09:00] words to thine own self be true. Because at the end of the day, we all will be dead a long time, and it’s better to be true to yourself rather than the, to, to w- whoever else, your family, friends, soc- society’s expectations, because what’s gonna matter at the end of the day is how you lived your life.
Mm. How Michael lived his life. Yeah. Well, it wouldn’t be so traumatic for me to attend, you know. Well, it sounds like it. That I wouldn’t, I wouldn’t attend. Then why don’t you just go on- But it just wouldn’t be my preference … for so, so bloody… Sorry. I hate people like you. I never get asked questions on this show.
It’s my one chance. I, I suppose I’ve gotta say to Andrew, hear hear, in that. The other thing is, is, is if you make the choice to actually go because you’re offering a gift to those other people. Mm. You know? It’s, it’s actually, you’ll, you’ve talked about healing and, and healing in a positive way in the sense of not causing a rift.
And we’re all part of a community, and we actually do do things because of what other people [01:10:00] need. It’s worthwhile checking that other people need that, though, too, before you- Make the assumption they need it … you actually do it. Yeah. But we all- ‘Cause they might be happy that I’m not there They might be very happy you’re not there.
Well, in fact, Michael- Steve’s often said that. Things would go a lot better if Michael wasn’t here. I, I’m on your side. I’m saying, “Hey, hey, Michael’s better than Nigel.” And on that- Well- Good evening, everyone. Uh, on that note, uh, the, the $64,000 question is, who is the funeral for? Because I’ve long thought it’s for the people left behind.
It’s not much use to the person in the box. And so it brings up a question. Now for me, I have moved to a point where, uh, I am not part of religious thought, communities, et cetera. Many of my family members are- Mm-hmm … and they are possibly going to step in and overtake things and employ that sort of language and an allusion, uh, to the funeral service no matter what I [01:11:00] write-
uh, in, in my last will and testament, but does it matter? Mm. Who is it, who is it actually for in the end? I think it’s a money-making scam peddled by celebrants.
Sick of celebrants, I’ve had enough. You know, you know we’ll have to kill you now, don’t you, Michael?
Well, I mean, who, who is it for, Andrew? Who’s it for? It’s for the, it’s for the living. Mm. It’s for the living. It’s, it’s, it’s their way of dealing with the loss of somebody they have hopefully loved and cared for and has been a major part of their lives. It’s for, for the living, pure and simple Mine would be about, it depends on what your belief system is and the belief system of your community.
And, um, so for, for many it’d be for the living, uh, even, even from those from a Protestant perspective, uh, they would say it was for the, the living as well as a celebration of their life. It has no effect on the actual person that’s been there. If [01:12:00] you go from a, a more traditional, so a Catholic, you know, Anglican Catholic Orthodox perspective, you would say there is actually effect on the actual person that’s actually died, that you’re actually, um, uh, you’re actually doing something for their eternal soul.
You’re actually helping them on that journey, the, the, on the journey of the way into, into death. Uh, to the extreme where it could be that if you don’t do certain things, they won’t go to heaven in some, some, uh, cultures. It’s not only Christian ones, it’s also, um, uh, all other types of, of, uh, religious and, and animist beliefs, uh, have beliefs that if you don’t do certain things, then like for Buddhists for example, if the person isn’t left for three days and, and a number of other rituals aren’t taking place, they can’t be reborn, or there’s some difficulty or negative, uh, karma that actually affects them, that actually, uh, inhibits their rebirth into the next, um, [01:13:00] reincarnation.
So, so some would say it’s actually for the living, some would say it’s for the dead, some would say it’s for both, and it depends. Mm. Um, the eulogy itself, yeah, I think is more for the living, um- Yeah … if you’re just looking at eulogy as, as what it is. But the other bits, it depends on the belief of the community.
And, and that’s just so even in, in any funeral as, um, uh, even in the most religious ones, you’re gonna have a thousand different, different views sitting out in front of you. A- a- absolutely, Brian. Yeah. Absolutely right. I never got asked to write you a eulogy, Steve. Oh. Not that I’m harping on about it by any stretch of the imagination, but I’d like to read you something that I’ve used on at a couple of funerals, which I think is quite profound and, and touches further on what Brett was just talking about a moment ago.
It’s, um, it’s, um, a piece of work written by Victor Hugo, a French poet, [01:14:00] novelist, and dramatist, and I’ll just … I’ll, I’ll give you the, the whole. I’d like to read something I believe would not only be appropriate, but also resonate with Steve, in the hope that he is once again reunited with those whom he loved and once loved him.
It was written by a French poet, novelist, and dramatist, Victor Hugo, a long, long time ago, and it’s called What Is Dying? What is dying? I’m standing upon that foreshore. A ship at my side spreads her white sails to the morning breeze and starts for the blue ocean She’s an object of beauty and strength, and I stand and watch her until at length she hangs like a speck of white cloud just where the sea and sky come down to mingle with each other.
Then someone at my side says, “There, she’s gone.” “Gone where?” [01:15:00] Gone from my sight. That’s all. She is just as large in mast and spar and hull as ever she was when she left my side. Just as able to bear her load of living freight to the place of her destination. Her diminished size is in me, not her And just at that moment when someone at my side says, “There, she’s gone” There are other eyes watching her coming And other voices ready to take up the glad shout Here she comes!
And that is dying
That’s some beautiful words. That is nice. I actually like that. I like it- Mm … from my belief system up until the [01:16:00] halfway point- … because I’m quite at rest with the fact that it disappears into infinity, gone, whatever. I’m quite peaceful with that. Mm. Wonderful thing about being a celebrant is if that’s what you believe, then I’ll cater to that.
That’s
an interesting point, though. There’s a, there’s a lack of responsibility there, though, then, isn’t there? Why? Because what you’re saying is that you’re saying that, um, just in the, in the very specific of that, that you fade. Um, noticing in that poem, one of the things it says that, that you continue to affect- Whether it’s the living or the dead or, or whatever, but you have a continuing effect.
So all the, the, um, things that you do in this life will have an effect forever. Yes, they will. And, yeah, and that you actually have to be responsible for that, so it doesn’t fade. Well, it d- no, well, that- There’s a… And that’s, uh, that’s… Is that the interesting thing from even just a, a [01:17:00] secular’s perspective?
No, look, I, I, I think you’ve grabbed the wrong end of the stick there, with all due respect. I’m not- But what he’s saying is so profound. It’s not. It is, it is. Because this is where, this is where Nigel, this is where Nigel, I have to s- s- it’s not often I agree with Nigel. But you think about it. Everything you do, everything, everything each and every one of us has ever done is in our DNA, which we pass on to our children.
I’m not disagreeing with that. Back to the religion, the sins of the father. I’m not disagreeing with that. All I’m saying is what that was suggesting to me- Whatever … was that it was being seen in some heavenly realm, and you’re reuniting with past ones, et cetera. Yeah, yeah. I- and so it’s… I was reading it through th- through that lens.
However- I didn’t read it through that lens, though, at all. I wasn’t actually even thinking… I was thinking of the worms that meet you, the, the other things that meet you, even in the physical sense. Yeah, so that the worms are saying, “Here she comes. That’s a great meal.” “Ar, ha-ha, cuck-cuck-cuck-cuck-cuck.” Uh, that’s fantastic.[01:18:00]
Pirate worms. Pirate worms. And, and, and look, to that extent- Mm … yes. I- it’s, uh, but the thing I take issue with the most is- Mm … it’s not a dodging of any responsibility. The responsibility almost is heavier because your chance to set whatever’s in motion through you happens over such a short period than those who believe you, uh, exist in some eternal plane in a spiritual sense compared to the physical sense that we’re talking about, as atoms and as the repercussions of our actions have affected others.
The things we, I could have done in my past that have affected some people negatively or positively, that like those little silver balls that bounce back and forth- Mm-hmm, mm-hmm … send repercussions through people’s lives forever, and they will impact other people forever. So I’m with you on that front.
Mm. I’m with you there, and I suppose I’ve just got a bee in my bonnet about [01:19:00] bringing in an extra layer, and it could just be words and imagery. All right, so this is, this is where I’m just wondering what your discomfort is that, that makes you so passionate at this point, Steven, with the word responsibility, actually.
‘Cause I actually think it’s a great way of dodging responsibility to invoke the sense of a greater being in the sky, and it’ll all be all right later, mate. Mm-hmm. Uh, and, and to me that’s the great hand passing of responsibility. So why is that important to you? Now, now this is just… Now, all this is saying, this is the next part of your journey.
Just because, uh, y- you know, you’ve passed away, and you passed away, and- The, w- everything the, the poem just said, everything the poem just said about, okay, gone from my sight. That’s all. Just as large a mast and spar and hull and all the rest of it- Yes … but the essence, the essence of who Steve Davis is continues.
It’s not lost, and it’s there. It’s in the memories of your family. It’s your children- Jesus … and it goes on. The DNA will go on forever and a day. [01:20:00] On the record now, I’m going to say I concede. I get it. I grabbed the wrong end of the stick. You’re only saying that is because I’m getting… I know I’m getting a bit aggressive.
I’ve had a couple of glasses of wine. I’ve got a knife in my hand. I can see that, and I acknowledge publicly- Yeah … that I thought I was pretty chill with having jettisoned a lot of that spiritual baggage of my past, and obviously there’s still a reaction against it that, that made me view that poem through that filter- Mm
when I didn’t have to. Mm. So there’s a little bit more time to elapse, to erode that away, smooth off the edges, and, uh, and move forward. So I’m really glad you read that. I- Mm. That is beautiful. I thought that was very powerful, actually. Yeah. Thank you. Yeah. Fantastic. I, I, I believe it’s very powerful as well.
He’s gonna use that now in his services. Yeah, well thank Victor Hugo, not me. It’s, it’s, uh, yeah, the one that I like with, um, secular ones where you [01:21:00] need to, to focus more on the secular space is John Donne’s mystical poem of No Man is an Island and, and that’s actually the opposite to a, to a certain extent.
Covers the same stuff of actually being part of, of a whole, um, which is one element of that, that poem, or that’s what I took out of it, but it, it doesn’t cover the, the loss as much as it does the gain, and that was the, the beauty of that, I think. Yeah. But, but it’s a pity because I was really looking forward to, to actually, uh, just hooking, grabbing onto some of those little hooks you just, you just-
spurted out before it, and you just took the whole wind out of my sails. Oh. Oh. Back to the poem. Back to the poem. Back to the poem. That’s beautiful. Back to the poem. Can I just- You could drown out there for years. And, and there’s, there’s, there’s another one of my favorite, favorite very profound poems that I, I absolutely love, and I, I, uh, recited it to Brett earlier on this evening before we, we started the podcast.
Mm-hmm. “I drink to your health when I’m with you.” Mm-hmm. “I drink to your health when [01:22:00] I’m alone.” I drink to your health so often, I’m starting to worry about my own. And, and what a beautiful, what a beautiful segue- … into the eulogies that we have recorded to listen to tonight. So, um, we, there was some drinking that took place at that event.
Uh, while one by one my guests went into the studio to secretly record their eulogy. Uh, we’re gonna play… Michael came up with the idea of doing them in reverse order of how long people have known me. Um, and so that means Brett’s is first. Michael, any words that we should have in our mind before we have a listen, and then we talk about each eulogy after we’ve heard it?
Uh, only that it was an odd way to deliver a eulogy, to be in a room on your own with a microphone. So something that I really, w- was really odd was that there was no audience, and I think an audience is a big part of a [01:23:00] eulogy, so that was a bit of a missing element w- in it. But having said that, listening to the eulogies and editing them was actually quite amazing.
I, I did have some tears in my eyes at a couple of points. Here is Brett’s eulogy. Actually, before we play it, would you like to introduce Brett as if you’re the celebrant, Andrew- … and call him to the, call him to the podium? I’ll keep it pretty simple and, uh, straightforward. Just let people know that any wailing you may hear in the background is prerecorded.
Brett, would you mind coming and saying a few words about that old bastard, Steve Davis? Eulogy for Davo. How can I speak good words at this time of grief? Yet good words they are because they’re of a good man who gave me and the world so much. When I heard today of [01:24:00] Steve’s death, when I received the Facebook post, my heart dropped.
For 20 minutes, I shook with fear, with sadness, and with disbelief, and I don’t always have that reaction when I hear of someone dying. But I, like so many who are here, a part of us has gone. A part of us is missing. A part of someone who’s been integral for our lives is no longer here
I’ve been privileged to know Davo since I was 15, and we met in 1980. And our relationship, like most, has been one of extreme closeness and sometimes distance, but it’s always been one that I’ve treasured. But it did have an interesting [01:25:00] start. Most of you know that Barry is a priest, and I met Steve in this context.
It was at Pulteney Grammar School. It was a fair on that day. Father Barry had organized an apple stand to raise money for St. Augustine’s, his church. It was for basically the youth group, which I was a member, and he had some of his family along to help. There was this young boy with a Beatles haircut. He was a bit quiet, didn’t make a lot of conversation.
But one thing that sticks is Steve’s constant insistence since then that he didn’t know whether I was a boy or a girl And I think this gender confusion in Steve has been a thing that’s something that stuck with Steve for much of his life. Steve’s real love for life was media, and it came in three real spurts.
One when he joined Vaughn Harvey’s Radio School, and that’s where he [01:26:00] learnt to speak with his signature deep, generous, sexy, and mellow voice. The second was his after-hours work as a traveling DJ, and there are so many stories about those weddings, parties, and any– everything or anything. And I had the privilege to occasionally work as his roadie and have a lot of fun doing it.
And there are lots of stories here to ask me about And then the Sunday we got up at 4:00 AM to drive to Murray Bridge for his job interview at Radio 5MU, which must have gone well, as straight on that day, he went straight into a whole shift where I sat in the car, ’cause Murray Bridge didn’t have a lot to go…
to do on, uh, Sundays, and some might say that nothing’s really changed. But he was brilliant. He went straight into a radio career. One little sideline, I used to spend a lot of time with Steve when he was growing up, and there was no doubt that training, practice, experience led to the ease with which he performed in that first [01:27:00] shift.
Often when visiting his house, I’d walk into his room, he wouldn’t know I was coming, and there he would be talking to his calculator, pretending it was a, um, a PA system, or he’d be mixing music on his, uh, small cassette player in those days of cassettes. These things were giving him confidence and experience and to headlong into that career of passion, radio, communications, media, that took him all over the world in radio, print media, TV, blogging, video blogging, and culminating in the now world-famous, The Adelaide Show podcast.
And Steve was a mixture of dichotomies. He had two sides to him in so many areas of his life. And one of the things that I think Steve missed in his life, and this is the really sad thing, I think, and I think it affected so many of the things he did, was how amazingly popular he was, especially with women and some men, of course.[01:28:00]
On one hand, he was often a loner, an introvert, tinkling with his microphones, calculators, and, and later computers, and other highly technical thingies. Whilst on the other hand, he’s seemingly an extrovert, performing a lunchtime radio show at, at Woodville High School, a serious play at La Mama Theatre, talking to Madge about her toaster on talk back radio, creating The Adelaide Show, um, Show podcast, or creating infotainment as a serious marketing and communications media workshop presenter for Baker Marketing and later for Williams & Court Davis.
I’ve never heard a negative word about his ability p- to perform, capture, or engage an audience. His Hugh Jackman good looks and acting ability, which sadly did not translate to singing and dancing, may have been the key to his success. But his performer’s engaging personality made him the star he is today [01:29:00] Or I guess we need to say, in our sadness, was.
One of the few things few of you would know was that Steve studied some theology and philosophy with the aim of becoming an Anglican priest, but like his equal, Tom Cruise, had a dreadful experience in church politics when he was priest warden for his very good friend, Chris. Good to see you here today, Chris.
And found some comfort in Nietzsche, perhaps identifying with the uber human and journeying into a theology of God is dead. Yet interestingly enough, from my perspective, there’s always been a deep spirituality in all of his atheism, and like most things in Steve’s life, when he believed something, he was deeply passionate about it and completely one-eyed.
To draw this back to his two sides, he swung from fundamentalist Christian, then fundamentalist liberal, to fundamentalist atheist, and this was similar with [01:30:00] his wine. One day he hated it, the next day he became a wine connoisseur. And the only thing that he’s ever been wrong about in that wine journey is Jacob’s Creek Claret.
So too with coffee. The current majority shareholder, creator, marketer, and blender for Baristador. Few of you would’ve known that when Steve was in his teens and early 20s, in those early days of specialized coffee shops such as Spats and Stamps in the underground, Steve hated coffee. His fare rather was hot chocolate and a crumpet One other thing that Steve had was a love for those around him.
He often found it hard to express, but it was there deeply, madly, passionately, like everything else. I remember when he heard that his sister Sharon was in some difficulty in Western Australia, like a white knight, he boarded a plane, [01:31:00] got over there, helped her out, got her onto a plane back to Adelaide safe and sound, and her life took on a new course.
His little sisters, Karen and Tanya, would often come up as examples of his skills in parenting, as he would lax lyrical as a 20-something-year-old on the beauties and trials of parenting, to the point where one day my mother rang me, uh, after listening to a particularly interesting nighttime talkback from 5MU and asked me if Steve had gotten some Murray Bridge girl pregnant and was now a father.
So a man of passion, whatever his current focus was, and this is what he leaves us with passion as a zest for life that’s been so tragically taken for us. For me, Steve was my friend. He stuck by me in some of the hardest times, especially in those early years growing up when life was just confusing for all of us He was always an inspiration to me, a [01:32:00] star, clever in so many ways.
Always, always beautiful. Always, always giving something of himself. But most of all, in Steve, we can see his legacy in what he’s offered so many people around him, the many ripples in, in entertainment and infotainment, the stuff that he’s offered to so many businesses in Australia for their very existence and growth.
We may see it in the multi-million dollar Barista Door empire, or his knighthood for contribution to social media. We may see it in the very joy Steve has given us through the way that he loved us. I see it essentially as his passion, or even more, in his ultimate passion for his wife, his two daughters, and the son that we never knew he had.
I hand over now to AJ to continue his story. I love you, Davo mate. Farewell on your journey. Rest in peace. You [01:33:00] didn’t have to mention about the crumpets and the hot chocolate. Oh, they were central. That needed to be said. It was. It’s, it’s, yeah. It’s just one of those things that I find… Oh, th- okay. So wow, that was moving.
I was… I didn’t expect to be as affected, uh, a- as I was in listening to that. Mm. There are a couple of times where had I been in that coffin, I would’ve wanted to reach over and just get you to move on a little bit. Um- Oh, and I left out the stories You did, and I appreciate that. Mm-hmm. I think to me, that’s the sign of a good friend, is you delicately edited my life nicely, Andrew.
Can I ask how you died? How I died? Mm. Mm, that’s a good question. I hadn’t actually thought that through when I’d asked. ‘Cause you’re young. Yeah. Ish. Ish. ‘Cause I, I, I looked at it about two years hence once he’d received the, you know, Medal of Order of Australia and, and, uh- The [01:34:00] knighthood. Yeah. No, that’s a captain’s call.
Yeah. The captain’s calls are finished. Yeah, yeah. Only, only for this month. And, and, uh Prince. Yeah, and, and I thought it must have been a tragic death. I, I would’ve thought might’ve… I, I think you would’ve had the heart, the money on the heart perhaps might’ve been- Mm … might’ve been, might’ve been the thing.
I don’t think so, because I got, think you got, uh, the heart of a lion. The heart, your, the heart, your heart will go on beating a long time after the rest of you is bloody gone. Right. Mm. So, yeah, so it must be maybe plane crash or something Y- y- you’re not suggesting- Terrorist attack … you’re not suggesting it’s a mechanical heart?
I’m seeing Bruce Willis. I’m seeing Die Hard, obviously. Well, I’m seeing him running like Hugh Jackman down the middle of the- Yeah … of the concourse. Yeah. Totally. Usain Bolt. Steve, are you surprised by your reaction? I am. Uh, ’cause I was driving here today, I was thinking, “How am I going to react?” And I thought, “I’ll be [01:35:00] quite circumspect and, and scientific about it,” because it’s an abstract exercise.
But there were a couple of… It was interesting. I think I held my armor reasonably well, but there were a couple of plunges there where he got the sword right under, in through the underbelly, right up, remembering some moments, uh, in that life, um, that wow, I, I probably… Y- y- you know what? The thing that made me tear up the most was, uh, one of the stories where I thought I probably stepped up to the plate very well.
And if you’re looking at the life as a little diagram, it’s like this towering thing in it- Mm … and you think, “Wow,” you know, didn’t really spend that much time in those lofty areas. But there was potential to do that when the time came. I think there was a real mixture of relief that, [01:36:00] that I stepped up to the fray, regret that I probably didn’t do it as much as I could have.
I- interesting that you actually had been, it had been mentioned, though Surprised that, that, um, you know, the contributions that you made that were fairly at the, at those peaks, you, that it was mentioned? Oh, I w- I actually, exactly. ‘Cause we’re talking about going to see my sister in, in, in- Mm … in WA. I was surprised that you would remember that, yes.
That, that’s, of all the things, you know, w- w- that was- But there are a million examples that could’ve been used, but that one I used because it actually would’ve affected someone who was there. And you- And, and it was, it was real. But again, there were a million examples that could’ve been used in those places.
See, I think you’re exaggerating just a smidgen. Well, a lot. But I- Well, I don’t know, actually. I don’t know … for me the thing was, there’s, there’s a few things where they’ve blipped above the, the thing, the, the, the average. Thank you, Brett. Mm. That was, um, that was beautiful. That so… It actually, you know what?
One thing I [01:37:00] d- it’s like you’ve been paying attention to my life. Mm. That’s the thing that, it’s like, w- we’re so busy, we’re like trains in a busy, crazy world of train tracks that intersect all the time. But you actually were paying atten- to pick up some of those things you picked up, you were actually paying attention.
So thank you. Mm. Let’s, um, move to our next one, if we’re game. Uh, which is actually Michael’s eulogy. It is. Uh, so anything we need to know before we hear yours? Uh, only that I found it really tough, and I did try and keep to the two-minute time limit. Andrew, do you wanna do your celebrant and, uh, job and call Michael Shanahan to the- Here’s Mikey.
Uh, if anyone’s listening to this who’s going to be organizing my funeral- I’m gonna give some stage direction to Andrew Rymer. I first met Steve on radio in [01:38:00] 1988 when he interviewed me about Murray Bridge Youth Theatre. And then he joined the Youth Theatre, and our journey began Steve’s always been someone who lived very publicly.
Everything he does is out there on Facebook. He makes a meal, he plays with his kids, he posts it for everyone to see. And I think the fact that I’m delivering his eulogy on his podcast is a perfect example of the sort of person he is. He likes to share himself with everyone. I remember when he was a kid, he used to have a large collection of tapes that were full of him pretending and practicing to be a DJ.
So he’d introduce songs, he’d play the song, he’d make comments, and he had a whole collection of them. And he and I used to listen to them and have [01:39:00] a good laugh. Um, I, I don’t think I’d ever met anyone who knew what they wanted to do from such a young age. You know, even when he was a kid, he was all about what he wanted to do and what he wanted to achieve, and it was always about some sort of performance or radio or really sharing his life with other people It’s hard to think of Steve without thinking of the term double entendre.
And I thought, “I can’t let his eulogy go without at least paying homage to him, the king of the double entendre.” So I actually did a bit of a Google search to see if I could find something, and the description of double entendre I think is the perfect description of Steve. It’s a word or phrase open to two interpretations, one of which is usually risqué or [01:40:00] indecent.
That’s Steve. It’s not just the smuttyness, but it’s the other half as well. He’s always there like a two people in one, and both those people are always coming out, often at the same time and in the same sentence. So I’ve been friends with him for 28 years, and during that time, we’ve lived together twice in two different houses.
We’ve spent probably the majority of our time laughing. We’ve performed together in lots and lots of shows and improvisations. We’ve cried together on many occasions, and we’ve philosophized together. We’ve really spent, you know, all of those parts of a life together. And over that time, he’s taught me so many things.
His logic freed me from religion and my own upbringing, [01:41:00] but not in a, not in a negative way. It was just his influence, really. His humor has often freed me from despair because he’s always there and willing to be funny and have fun. His spontaneity has freed me from fear. I’ve always admired the way he goes about something and does it despite how fearful he is.
And his puns have freed me from becoming too attracted to him over the years. I’ve never met another person with the abilit- to be, um, ability to be so supremely silly and profound in one breath. And finally, I think Steve was a wonderful father. I can’t imagine anyone being more proud of their children.
So I thought I’d finish with his own words, written f-for his children, but equally relevant to me as a [01:42:00] friend. So this is a poem for Alexandra and Caitlin by Steve This flawed dad chimes I love you aloud on the hour like some frenzied benevolent cuckoo while not hidden in busy work. This flawed dad is yearning for some magic balance before the spring goes flat.
This flawed dad, sitting in the corner of your lives like a giant grandfather clock, will always be your emergency service, your manservant, your dad. And if he gets the timing right, one day he’ll be basking in the warmth and satisfaction of being your friend. Cuckoo, cuckoo, cuckoo I hope that I’ve been a friend to you, Steve.
You’ve [01:43:00] certainly been a friend to me. I hope you found your balance, and that you’re not too upset that your spring has now gone flat. Michael, I’ve gotta say, that’s a low blow. Oh, what? Using my own words. Wow. I’m actually very proud of that poem. It was fantastic. ‘Cause it was… I haven’t written poems for ages ’cause a friend of mine- Oh
Norm Munro- … at a writer’s group in the late ’80s told me I was trite, and I lost all confidence- Oh … in writing poetry. Uh, but that one, I couldn’t stop it. It just had to come out. Uh, ’cause there was that sense of busyness, and, and yes, choices you make, uh, choices that have got you to a point where maybe you feel your choices are limited.
You’re wanting to- Mm … uh, just that analogy. Whenever I think of, of whenever I’m thinking of, uh, whenever I hear [01:44:00] someone talk about existential angst, um, you come to mind. And, uh, your, especially your poetry, which I’m interested to know why you have… I haven’t seen any for such a long time, and hadn’t seen that.
I’d, I’d love to post that on Adelaide Night & Day Family Therapy and talk about parenting- Oh … and fatherhood, uh, in that, ’cause there’s a, there’s, there’s a, an angst in there that actually most of us actually live with as a parent. So- Mm. So, and, and you just blurt out your angst in, in so many different ways.
Which I was wanting to play earlier before you took the wind out of my sails earlier. Right. That was, that was where what was coming out- Mm … on my own, or so I thought. I, um, so thank you for sharing that- Mm. Mm … ’cause I would’ve been happy for my girls because they would’ve lost that in the torrent of my Facebook.
Wow. Um- Did you, is that where you grabbed it from? No, it was on your blog. Oh, yes, I blogged- Yeah … I blogged that one. The thing I wanna come back to is the, the, the concept that [01:45:00] I helped you free yourself from religious thoughts. Mm. ‘Cause when I remember us having a conversation on that topic, it was either it was in the ’80s or early ’90s on a motorbike where I was-
holding on for sheer fear of death to the back. You were giving me a lift across town because I had to pick up a car that was being serviced, or your car or something, and I was petrified. And I remember us having a discussion about religion as a result of that journey. Oh, as a result? I thought you tried to do it while you were- While, while you’re on the journey.
Oh, God. Yes, yes. Oh, God. Yeah. No, you never talk about life or death with anyone in control of a vehicle that you’re, uh, helpless in. Uh, so that was, that was… I did not expect, did not expect that. Oh, really? Mm. Oh, I thought you knew that. No, you’ve had a profound effect on me in that regard because- I apologize
Oh, no, don’t apologize. You know, when you’re brought up religious, my parents were extremely religious- Mm … still [01:46:00] extremely religious. And, and I was brought up in a Catholic school, and so probably all my life I was surrounded by religion and religious thinking. So when you started talking to me about perhaps not believing in religion, it actually scared me.
It was a really scary thing for me. But I love that, you know? I love that challenge and that way of thinking, and I remember having lots of philosophical discussions and arguments with you, and, you know, I always reflected on them. Perhaps I didn’t ever feed back to you- No … you know, the, the effect that it had on me.
But, you know, I suppose what I was saying before, I’m a reflective sort of person, so in the moment I’ll, we’ll have an argument, but then, you know, I’ll really let it sink in and let it change my thinking, and you’ve, you definitely did that for me. Mm. There was a lot going on int- internally. Mm. Mm. A lot going on internally, which you didn’t mention to Steve.
Yeah, and I’ve always respected [01:47:00] you and your intellect. Like, I think you are a great thinker. You think? Yeah. No, I do. You know? And, and that’s, and that’s why I have that- That was very clever. Thank you, Andrew … That’s why I have that duality of you, because you can in one breath be profound and smutty. Mm.
And it’s, and it’s- You know? The double entendre has nothing to do with anything else except for smutty. Yeah, that’s right. Guys, can I just interject on that? And I, and I, and again, I know it’s all about Steve tonight, but I, I just wanna say thank you. Gee, you picked it, didn’t you? Yeah, yeah. But thank you, thank you for letting me into the circle of trust.
Mm. It… I really feel like I’m in the circle of trust tonight because you’re talking about some pretty deep and meaningful things here. Oh. Uh, life, death. Uh, it doesn’t get more important than that. Friendship, the relationships that you’ve formed and built over the years and your personal memories. And I, I’m, I’m finding it incredibly profound, so thank you.
And, and I’m serious. You would’ve been there. It was only because it had to be a Saturday night [01:48:00] Otherwise you would’ve been on that list had you- I’m talk- I’m not just talking about Saturday night I’m talking about, uh, y- your whole lives. For God’s- Yeah, the whole thing. Yeah. No, I, I, I know, I know. I know that.
No, no, I don’t know that. Steve, Steve, Steve will- But thank you. Thank you … Steve’s gonna be apologizing to you now for probably the next 50 years, so- Oh. Did, did he ever tell you about the conversation we had one night? We’d been doing the, uh… It was still another boring night in Adelaide podcast, right? And I used to, I used to give Steve a bit of stick because he’s fairly easy game, right?
Would you agree? No. I would, I agree. Agree 100%. And judging by your eulogies- A walking target. Yeah. And so on air, I, I was, I, I, I guess trying to create this little bit of, uh, uh, animosity between us where I’m always… He’s trying to move on from the another boring Adelaide night- Mm … another boring night in Adelaide to the Adelaide show, and I’m saying, “No, I like the Adelaide…”
And one night or one afternoon I get this phone call out of the blue, and it’s Steve Davis. “Hello, Andrew.” Steve Davis. “Yes. Hello, Andrew. It’s Steve Davis [01:49:00] here. How are you?” And yes, the arms, you could tell the arms were folded. “I just wanted to speak to you.” Because, and I, I can’t remember everything you said, but the, the, the ge- general gist was it, it’s obviously you’re not enjoying our conversations on air and the podcast, and if you think it’s time to move on, then it’s time to move on, and I completely get that and all.
It was Mr. Defensive, right? You know- He, he made the phone call. Yeah, he made the phone call. He made the phone call. No. And I was so affronted. Yes. He was … I was so affronted, and I said to Steve, “Steve, what are you bloody well talking about?” Because he’d, he’d come under a bit of criticism from a couple of other people who said they didn’t enjoy the program.
And- They didn’t like it. And he thought that was m- my o- my own feelings. And I had to explain it couldn’t be further from the truth, and I saw it as an integral part of Sunday nights. [01:50:00] And it, the, the … I was trying to create this sort of animosity between us so as a bit of a hook for people to listen into it.
These guys are giving n- each other the shits. So we’ve gotta listen in because they’re giving each other the shits, and they’re gonna have a go at each other. And so, but, and so he missed the complete point, and I had to actually concede- I know … that I actually love what he does, and I love him as a per- well, I’m not sure if I love him as a person.
That’s fair. No, no, no, no. I don’t know him well enough to- No, I was willing to fall on my sword for the greater good. But you were willing to throw it all away for what? Well, yeah- For a misperception … to only be where you’re wanted. That’s the, that’s the thing. Well, you were wanted, but you didn’t get it. No, I didn’t get it.
I misread you, and I admit it. And thank God you didn’t write a eulogy for me. Although that- No, did, you know, at least gave the poems as the farewell, so. But yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, you, you can read the poem. You can at least read the- I’d like to read something I believe would not only be appropriate- All right
but also resonate with Steve. You know, that he is once again reignited with those- We- Oh, did it resi- did it, did it [01:51:00] resignate? All right. Um, no, well, but I’m, I’m glad you remembered that ’cause I remember that. Sorry, resonate. The next eulogy- That was a very Freudian- The next eulogy is from Simon Butters, a friend of mine through writing, theater, coffee, squash, uh, and, uh, just life around town.
Um, Michael, anything we should know before we hear Simon’s? ‘Cause you’re the only person who’s heard these. Oh, look, I’m happy for you to be surprised. Okay. Simon, Simon is such a great writer. Mm. It’s quite a different take. Great variety. All right. Take it away, Simon. Excuse me. I just came in through the back passage I’ve polished it all morning.
Now I’ve got a very clean machine. I don’t know about you, but I enjoy being rubbed up the wrong way. Ah, Steve Davis. A quick Google search lists the masters of the double entendre as Shakespeare, [01:52:00] Mr. Humphries from Are You Being Served?, and Steve Davis of The Adelaide Show. Most people don’t get a single entendre, yet alone the dubious little parcels of naughtiness that come out of Steve’s mouth.
They stand mouth agape, their eyes moving left to right slowly, wondering if Steve had really meant to say something about oiling up a tight space in public, in front of children, old people, or recorded forever online. In his passing, Steve remains a mystery. I guess we’ll never know the depths he has plunged with his penis.
Yeah, I’m not as good as he was at this kind of thing. But there was a lot more to Steve than a quick wit. He was a family man, a lover of fine food and copious amounts of fine wine. He was also a fine friend [01:53:00] Steve and I met in our theater days. I was part of a group of student theater grads who were very idealistic and keen to experiment with theatrical form, no matter how small.
And it was small, there’s no pun intended. The theater we took over down at La Mama on Port Road had about 50 seats in a damp cellar, and had been used for years to put on titillating bedroom farces. I guess Steve felt right at home. We took over for a few short years and mixed things up. We challenged the prevailing orthodoxy that amateur theater was just crap.
Okay, it was still a little bit crap, but it was artistic crap. Steve was into radio and had lived with Michael Shanahan, another friend of ours, who was our beloved theatrical guru and spiritual leader. Steve was in a couple of plays that I wrote and directed, experimental stuff, art house, absurdist, [01:54:00] highly stylized, grotesque kind of theater.
His performance in The Dinner Party in 1994 of a television celebrity chef was delightfully hideous. Steve mutated into a creature that was part Sir Les Patterson, part Matt Preston, years before reality TV cooking programs took off. His character was like a creepy ogre gorging himself with food, stained with red wine, lasciviously rubbing himself up against pretty young women every chance he got.
Well, art reflects life, I guess. Some of you may not know this, but Steve was also a good sportsman. And when I say good, I mean that he could hit a ball pretty well. No pun intended. I mean an actual ball made of rubber and covered in soft furry… Anyway, sports, things like tennis and [01:55:00] squash. In our 20s, Steve and I used to find a disused tennis court somewhere and battle our own version of international brat pack tennis.
We’d argue line calls, grumble at lucky shots, reluctantly congratulate the other on a nice serve. Basically, I could ace Steve, and he could get the shots back. He was a bit like an oversized Lleyton Hewitt versus a crippled Mark Philippoussis. We even had a little cup called the Davis Cup. In the years we played, I think I only ever won that cup maybe two or three times For all the other games, Steve would remove that little wooden cup from his sports bag, congratulate himself on his wonderful tournament, hold it above his head to thank his non-existent adoring fans, and ting– take it back home to place on his mantelpiece and wonder at his own magnificent glory.
I hated that fucking little [01:56:00] cup. Anyway, um, years later, in our 30s, we turned to squash. This was after I’d lived interstate for nearly a decade, and we had tried to find something to do that kept the middle age spread at bay a little bit and provided an outlet from work and family. It also meant we didn’t have to run as much like we did in tennis, which we could– and we could also play in a, in da- in the dark and, uh, after dark, I should say, and indoors.
But, you know, you get a little bit soft as you get older. But the games, they were still tough. We still had that old fighting spirit. On a good drop shot, Steve still had that gloating way about him that piqued mine of fury. He loved to psych me out. Hmm. That was the real attraction for him, I think. For Steve, enjoyment came from annoying his opponents until they cracked.
But I’m not bitter. Nope, not bitter at all. I gave as good as I got. No pun intended. [01:57:00] Sadly, we gave up squash after my knees also finally cracked. Steve will be remembered every time the arthritis in my left knees groans remorse for running after all those sneaky drop shots. Well done, Steve. Well done. Now, it’s in a eulogy that you can poke a little bit of fun at an old friend who has passed well before his time.
But a reflection about a man’s life should also address some of the darker times. Steve’s girlfriend from those theater days, Anya, was a wonderful person, beautiful. Yet most knew that she’d suffered from some kind of psychological ailmen- ailment, and ultimately, this led to a break in our own friendship.
My partner, Penny, and I had a falling out with Steve and Anya over something we never really understood. We didn’t know what precipitated the end of our friendship, but it was over. Years later, we [01:58:00] heard that they had broken up. We obviously– we weren’t surprised, really. I mean, sadly, also, Anya had died of breast cancer some years ago, and we never had the chance to say goodbye.
She just left our lives one day, and that was it. She was gone. And I think that’s more tragic than anything I can imagine. And I’m glad that Steve can be remembered today and that we can all share our fond memories of him Track forward a few years, Penny and I were overjoyed when Steve fell in love with Nadia.
Nadia was thoughtful and grounded, everything that Steve wasn’t, and that’s a great thing. In life, Nadia complemented Steve perfectly. He’d finally found the girl who was right for him. Steve and Nadia shared a love of fine wine and good times with family. They made two delightful little girls, Alexandra and Caitlin.[01:59:00]
In time, Steve and I reconnected. Healing had begun. A lifelong friendship rekindled over squash and a little bit of red wine. Not at the same time, but often in quick succession. We thank Nadia for helping Steve to achieve the best in his life. We know that you and your girls will miss him deeply today, but just know that in your presence, we could see that Steve was finally happy Being happy.
That’s what it’s all about, I think. Steve, in his mad cap and gregarious ways, had always sought to be happy. Along the way, he made a lot of other people happy, too. Steve Davis, we’re going to miss you The, the one thing that strikes me about Simon’s eulogy that made me breathe a sigh of relief is those lovely words towards Nadia and my girls at the end.
It’s like- Mm … there’s a [02:00:00] sense that they’re not left alone. There’s these arms wrapping around them. Mm. Uh, I thought that was, that was a beautiful touch, the way he brought that back. Mm. Mm. Wow. Yeah. He, uh, he’s definitely a, a, he’s definitely a writer, isn’t he? That was a, it was a piece of poetry, really. It was almost a elegy.
Orchestral. It was orchestral- Yes … the way he brought in the strings, and then he had the- Mm. The wind section. Mm. And there was a lot of that. Uh, yeah. I wanna ask you a question, Steve, um, before we get to the next eulogy and because I, I don’t wanna forget this question, because when it, when it comes to funerals, generally as a rule, there are a number of songs played.
Oh. And there’s a song at the beginning, the introduction, there’s the reflection, and then there’s the, um, the committal, after the committal, where the song is played at the end when people leave the, the service. The songs, [02:01:00] the three songs, which is generally the rule, sometimes there’s more, sometimes there’s less, you would like played at your funeral.
Wow, how did I plan this episode without giving that any thought- Ever … whatsoever? That’s why you’ve got me and Brett. Yes, exactly. Uh, yeah. ‘Cause, ’cause it’s funny, I’ve actually got three songs that, um, that I’d have straight on you saying that. I’ve got three- For your- … that I’d actually… No, for Steve’s. Oh, I’ve three in mind.
Yeah. Three straight up. What were, what were yours? Are they all Leonard Cohen? They all… This, this… No, no. They all have… No, I, I wouldn’t do that because, um, that would be something if, after you put a lot of thought into it, you’d actually obviously choose Len- Leonard Cohen three times. But, um, more is about my journey with Steve and the, and, and his days of a DJ And, uh, and the songs that he introduced me to.
So for the reflection after the eulogies would be Ashes to Ashes by David Bowie, where [02:02:00] he opened up David Bowie to me. But obviously, you know, Ashes to Ashes is, has a lot of things about your, your life journey. Yep. Um, to, to, um, start with would be, It Only Hurts When I’m Laughing. Oh, Mazzy Star. Yeah. Yes.
Mazzy Star ’cause that was so central to his- That was … his early years, and so therefore the introduction of him to life and, um, yeah. And the, uh, final one being Cocaine by J- uh- J.J. Cale … J.J. Cale. Oh. And that is because he used to, in, um… He would always play it at discos to, um, to get people up and dancing.
So at the e- why at the end is to get people up and dancing. I thought it would’ve been to get people leaving. I thought so.
I know that that’s obviously for the long pass, not what you’d choose for today, but that were, they were the things that, that struck me straight away on the, on the ask- asking of the question. Nice. Michael, you got some thoughts? [02:03:00] Oh, well, I… If I had to pick three songs for Steve- Mm … the first one would be Video Killed the Radio Star.
Yeah. The Buggles. Because- … when I first met you in Murray Bridge- Yeah … Five MU was doing… I think they were changing stations or moving somewhere, and they ran a big competition- Yeah, we moved from- To choose … 1458 to 1125. Yeah. And they ch- they ran a big competition to choose the first song that was gonna be played.
Yes. Which was gonna be in my show. Yeah. Ooh. And I kept bugging you to give me a clue as to what song it might be so I could enter the competition and win the money, but you would never budge. But Video Killed the Radio Star was the song that won. No. Oh, no, it wasn’t. No. That was my pick. That was your pick.
Oh, yeah. The one that wr- won- Turn Up the Radio … by the Masters- Masters at Arms Yeah, that’s right. Yeah. Turn Up the Radio. And, um, and, and what girl did you give that song to so that she could win the- Competition. Yeah, that’s right. So one of those two. Would be that. Yeah. We’re getting back to the cherry conversation or?
[02:04:00] I am thinking about these songs, and I really don’t know. I, I think one song that has to be there is, um, Don’t Think Twice, It’s All Right, uh, by Johnny Cash of Johnny Cash 1970. Oh. His version of the Bob Dylan song. Yeah. Uh, because when I grew up, my parents had a few records, and the ones I liked the most I played was Seekers Sing Their Big Hits- Mm.
Yeah … and Johnny Cash ’70. And that- Do I remember. On that so- On that, the, the pathos in that song about- Mm … you know, this girl’s leaving his life, is it … And he just take, he brings down the armor and says, “Well, don’t think twice.” I love it. “It’s all right.” Yeah. Mm. You know, “You just kinda wasted my precious time, but hey.”
A- and I think that song would have to be an opener. Mm. Ah. I think. Why Johnny Cash and not, um, not, uh, Bob Dylan? Not Bob Dylan. Because Johnny Cash was the version that I grew up with. Mm. They’re both good versions actually. Mm. Um, Cash has a knack of covering songs very well- Mm … and [02:05:00] bringing something to them.
So that’s definitely there. There’d have to be a Leonard Cohen song, and I don’t know which one it would be. It’d have to be Anthem, wouldn’t it? Yeah, look, I, I think Anthem… I tell you what, there’s two I would pre- prevaricate between. One was, um, when I was working in Murray Bridge at 5MU, and I was doing theater in Adelaide with Michael.
The first time I did some Adelaide theater with you, I had these trips down the freeway to do, you know- We’re talking about driving trips. We are, yeah. And I had to, uh, so- Well, well, might be both really. Had, had to knock- Which we don’t advocate at all. No, we don’t. I had to knock off at 6:00, get down there for 7:00, 7:30 for rehearsals.
Thank you. Finish 10:00, 10:30, 11:00 at night, and then drive back ready to get up at 4:00 in the morning- Mm … and start all over again. And so I needed story songs to keep me awake. And I went to where the Woolworths Shopping Center is now in Murray Bridge. There was a, like, a CC Records record shop. Oh, yeah.
And it had a [02:06:00] discount bin out the front of cassettes. And in there, there was a cassette called Songs of Love and Hate, Leonard Cohen. And I thought, “These sound like story songs to me.” And I hopped in my white HG70 panel van that night and headed down. I flipped this cassette in, and the opening song is Avalanche.
Mm. “I fell into an avalanche, it covered up my soul” were the first lines I heard, and I was hooked. And, uh, so that was great. But then the song Anthem, which came out years later, “There is a crack in everything. That’s how the light gets in.” I think that c- that marries with your poem that you read, the sentiment that Brett’s been talking.
There’s something about- Nothing is ever either fully black or white. You know, as black as it can be- Mm … there’s a crack there, there’s a, the bit of white or vice versa. Uh, remember even in the super beautiful white times, there’s that still that shadow in the, in the background. Mm. [02:07:00] And, and I think that’s beautiful.
Is that a bit racist, or? No, that’s not. That’s purely
I don’t know what the third, I don’t know what the third song would be. Do you know, the, the thing that surprised me the most is you actually paying for A cassette? Well, it was on, no, in the discount bin. It was in the discount bin. Yeah. It was cheap. But you paid for it. I know. I did have a lot of free stuff given to me back in those days.
Ah, the amazing stuff that then actually became part of my record collection. Yes. It shows, it sh- shows the affluence of those days though, that we actually had discount bins. Normally, bins were just things you threw away, but this was a discount bin where
So, so one I think that- So to say farewell, you know, at the end, uh- The, the, the final song, I’ll think about that, uh, in just a moment. Give me a moment to think about it, ’cause I wanna hear Adam Claridge’s, um, thoughts. ‘Cause, ’cause th- His eulogy. Well, ’cause I was just gonna say, ’cause there’s two ways you can actually use that last, that last song.
You can use it as people pay their last [02:08:00] tributes, doing the last thing for you that they can do, the last gift which is, you know, helping go figuratively where it comes from. Those offering of tributes at the end and going past the coffin has to do with actually the family burying you in the past, ’cause that was the last gift you could give someone in this earthly life, was to actually dig their grave and bury them and, and we don’t do that anymore, and that’s actually- Mm-hmm
a, a, a sad thing, I think. And so you can choose it for that, or you’re going off into the distance- Yeah … as you’re heading off. I just wanna say, I’ve been to a number of funerals where there’s been the, uh, the service and the, the chapel, followed by the committal at the grave site. Mm. And family members have dug the grave or w- have contributed to digging the grave- Mm
but then, uh, certainly covered the grave, and they find it very cathartic. Mm. Wow. Very cathartic. It’s… And, and, and it’s so… I, I… Y- you can see the spiritual level, but also on the physical level- Mm … they’re dealing with [02:09:00] that emotion- Yes. … that energy. Yeah. And it- He’s coming back. Yeah. It’s, it’s, it’s wonderful.
Wonderful. Makes it very real, doesn’t it? Yeah, it does. Yeah. It does. Gives- It’s, it’s done more in the country. Yeah. I’ve never seen it done in the city, interestingly enough. I, I’ve, I’ve… Yeah. That’s fantastic. I’ve done it, done it here in the city, but it’s, it, it gives, it, it gives them back the power- Mm
which we’ve lost. We, we don’t have any control over life and death- Mm … but we do have control over this. Yeah. They’re brilliant. Well, thank you for that talking, ’cause not only was it interesting, but it also inspired me. There’s two songs I wanna finish with. And, and they have a great meaning. I, I wanna- I gotta learn when to shut up.
I think, I think what I’ll do- Well, no, what you did is what you probably do when you’re preparing people and, uh, for funerals, and that’s you say, “This is the purpose of this- Yeah. Yeah … this part, or this could be the purpose.” ‘Cause there’s no black and whites. It’s actually whatever journey people need to be taken through.
And, and so the idea of saying the, y- what you did was you gave us a, a purpose to what we’re doing- Mm … in it, and, uh, and so therefore- So that leads me to I, I, I actually think I need to make a [02:10:00] radio cassette mixtape for my funeral so that people can listen on the way home- Oh, no … to me back announce and forward announce.
Oh. They, they, they won’t have to if they just listen to this. Um- They can listen to this for the next 50 years of your life. Actually, I’d love that. That’d be great. Yeah. Uh, thanks for coming today. Uh, I actually am doing that now for the girls in the car. I do time, calls, weather, and requests. However, um- There are two songs I’d like to finish with.
One of them would be Neil Diamond’s Morningside because, uh, that is at the heart of what that poem, the, the poem that, uh, P- that, um, Michael read about the clock and being there for the, for the girls, for the family because it starts with, “Morningside, an old man died.” And it’s all about- His epitaph is for my children.
Uh, he carved it into a table that he made that they, they gathered around, they had meals around. And we’ve got a beautiful wooden table at home, and I was inspired to pick that with Nadia, um, [02:11:00] because I wanted that table. I wanted that wooden solid table that will be marked. And I, I, I don’t like us trying to protect it.
I want divots in it. I want s- milk stains. I want all that stuff because it’s– it captures the life. So that would have to be a song. It’s a story of your life. Yeah. And then as they leave, um, Glenn Gale had the Collingwood theme song played over and over again ’cause he was a Collingwood man. You know what I’d have?
What else? The Adelaide Show theme song played three times on the way out, the extended version. Oh, not that one we heard tonight. Yeah, no, not, not that one. Not that one. Steve, Steve- The real one … you’re, you’re a showbiz man. One of the great adages of, of show business is always leave them wanting more.
Okay, I’ll stick with I’ll stick- And, and that wouldn’t be the way of doing it I’ll leave- He’ll still be drowning on when people are walking out Adelaide. Adelaide. I just– I used to love that. I used to love that. Adelaide, [02:12:00] Adelaide, it doesn’t matter. All right. I, I wonder whether the choosing of the, the, um, last, uh, singer was actually, uh, uh, looking toward Jonathan Livingston Seagull and, uh, some other spiritual being.
No, that was an atrocious album. All right. Would you like to call Adam Claridge, please? Adam. Adam, would you mind waking up, please? Adam, Adam, would– Okay, can somebody give him a nudge? Adam, yes, would you– Yeah, you’re meant to be coming up and having a couple of words on behalf of Steve. Would you mind?
Thanks. Okay. Thank you. He’s our second to last. Oh my goodness, he knows Adam, doesn’t he? No, I don’t. Cheers, Adam. I, uh, just have to say to begin with that any shortfallings in the eulogy are hopefully made up for in the quality of wine that was consumed this evening. And being a primary school teacher, my chosen medium of finger paint and clay [02:13:00] and Play-Doh and glitter were not available because radio, of course, is not a visual medium.
Uh, so please just imagine the glitter sprinkled across. And I must confess my surprise at being asked to speak here and give a eulogy for Steve. I feel as though I only knew one small part of Steve. We had a friendship that spanned a good number of years, but of late, we hadn’t seen each other a great deal due to mainly to the tyranny of distance and the vagaries of young children.
When we did, though, things were pretty easy, slipping back into conversations that might have been going for a long time. A sign I like to think of a good friendship. Steve was certainly a good friend. Never one to give up on you or let you down or run around, and certainly he’d never desert you. Always ready for a chat about anything really, [02:14:00] especially philosophy, like a walk on slippery rocks or religion, like a light in the fog.
We often discuss things such as mankind’s desire to be forever young and decided, do you really want to live forever? To be honest, I don’t know what I’m to say, but I’ll say it anyway. I do know he loved his wine and coffee. In fact, he taught me a great deal about coffee, and I will now forever think of him when I look at the crema on my coffee.
Some might say it’s much too late for goodbyes. Yes, that it’s much too late for goodbyes, and these are only small things I know. But we’re here to celebrate as well as commiserate the good times as well as these bad times. So let’s celebrate good times. Come on I always knew, Steve, that wherever you’d go, I’d go with you.
But this is one journey I can’t take, so [02:15:00] here you go again on your own, down a road that the rest of us have never known. And so finally, here is the last advice that I’ll ever be able to give you. Steve, whatever you do, don’t pay the ferryman. Don’t even fix that price until he gets you to the other side.
Adam did come out from recording that night- Goodness … and he said, “Please don’t hold it against me.” I ac- I, I am astounded how profound, at least for me- Yeah … that reverberated really profoundly, as have each of the, the eulogies. Um, but the way Adam went in was, was like he was, he was pissed and was just like, “Ah, yeah, I’ll just go in and I’ll do two minutes and, and walk out.”
Um, and I, I did not expect that. I expected one joke and then out again, and, and that was it, and, and that was astounding. What resonated so deeply with you? Well, every section of him actually talking from [02:16:00] his heart. But he wasn’t. He was bloody quoting songs. He was wasn’t he, at every point. At every single point.
But it was- But he still chose those songs. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. It was him. It, it’s what he connected with- Yeah … as far as going back to the emotions. And as being a radio person- Yeah … and you, Steve, would have got… You get it. You get it. Yeah. Because it’s what, it’s… Th- th- this is why musicians are so profound.
They relate to us- Mm … the listening audience, what it is we are thinking and trying to say, but they do it and get paid a fortune for it. And, and, and I’ve never noticed someone actually be able to quote songs where they’re actually… Like, you listen to Ostentatious- Yeah … who does all the things that he does.
Yeah. And, and even going back to some of Steven’s, uh, Steve’s favorites, which were, you know, Plussey and, uh, and all that. Oh, not Peter Plus. Peter Plus? I loved it. He was fantastic. I’ll go get the record in a minute. Oh, God. I did, did, w- w- w- But Adam did it with actually thinking it … oh, it’s so politically incorrect [02:17:00] now.
I, uh, the, my, my one quote from him comes to mind, and I can’t repeat it. No, quote. No, I can’t because I’ll get into trouble. No, that’s okay here. It’s okay if you say it, it’s okay. No, it’s not. I’ll get the sack. Okay. You might, might if you did it on radio, but this is- They used to do it, they used to do it and get away with it on air.
We’re, we’re, we… Sorry, we’re digressing away from Steve. Go on. But, but Adam, Adam, interestingly enough, the way he did it was that, that he might have used all of them, but it was from him And that was, that was very profound. Um, I was, I was impressed And also when he knew me, I still had my radio involvement and such, so y- for me, for him to be using pop song- Mm
to be doing my eulogy was actually, it works. He, he must- It’s like a patch, a patch mint quilt … he must be a bloody good teacher. He’d be a great teacher. Yeah. I think it goes with, I think it goes back to that point you were making earlier as well about it’s great to have a variety. Yes. So it’s the individual- Mm
you know, it’s not just Steve’s [02:18:00] story that comes out, but it’s the story of the person and their relationship with Steve and the different parts of him that they’ve connected to. Mm. And then that allowed, um, the reverberation with the individual, I think. Yes. It did at least with me anyway. That’s a really good point because what, the way he did that, choosing, you know, public property, public wordage- Yeah
uh, it left space for each of us. Just like your poem, Andrew. Mm. I interpreted it one way, Brett another. I got it right. Uh, and, uh, but, you know, it was- Yeah, that, that will be the day. Yeah. When you say goodbye. That was, that was Buddy Holly. Yes. I, I can’t remember you apologizing actually. It happened, it just got edited out ’cause of time reasons.
Uh, but, you know, so yeah, there’s something about that. Now, uh, it’s been really fascinating, different to what I… It wow. You two, Andrew and Brett, don’t encourage people to do this, do [02:19:00] you? You don’t encourage people to get their friends to write their eulogies and record them, do you? Ah. Or do you? Well, we record them in what- Pe- while they’re still alive
we call them- No. What’s happening tonight? You don’t condone? That, that can sometimes… That, that’s actually- Well- … there’s a, there’s a spirituality that you do in therapy where you actually get people to write their own eulogies. Right. Not other people writing it for you. I would’ve sucked at it. My own eulogy would be horrible.
Mm. Mm. It needs- But it’s- … to be by someone else. Mm … but except for the fact that the, the purpose of the, the meditation or the mindfulness exercise has to do with actually, um, looking at your own death. Okay. And actually acknowledging… And that’s what you were talking about, the fact that, that, um, in… Uh, no sorry, it was Andrew really who was really bringing out that whole point of the, the fear of, of your own mortality.
Um, you mentioned at one point- Yes, I did. Yeah … about that and, and the fact that coming to terms with the fact that we’re not going to be here one day- And, and [02:20:00] reflecting on that and what that means and maybe what people will say about us, which is obviously what Steve’s trying to work through, through this show- Mm.
um, means that, that we can actually make change. ‘Cause one of the things we know, and we know that with people who’ve actually made the decision to, to, um, take their own life, is that usually at that point when they’ve made the absolute decision that that’s going to happen and they’ve planned for it, they start ma- they start putting their affairs in orders, order.
And then any decision they make makes no difference. You know, they know that, that they don’t have to worry about all the angst that’s caused them to take, to go to the point of taking their own life. And, and everyone says, “But they were so happy for those last weeks.” Because they were in control. They- They, they, they perceived they were in control.
Yeah. But I guess at the end of the day, and ac- actually, on, on that subject, I really want to say this, ’cause it’s very important. Um, nobody really at the end of the day, none of us are in control, and that’s why we believe, people believe [02:21:00] in a greater God, a greater purpose, a greater being, and all that sort of business- Mm
because we don’t have control. Um, what I really, I think is important, and like anybody, each, we’re all in our 50s. I imagine, Michael, you’re- Oh, thank you … be a lot, lot older.
Sorry. I, I look in my, I look 35. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I share that. All right. No, but seriously, I, I’m… Each and every one of us when it comes to life, and we’re digressing a bit away from the, the actual eulogy and all the rest of it, but this is part and parcel of what we’re talking about, ’cause I’ve had to do some suicides, and they haven’t been very pleasant affairs- Mm
’cause it’s very tragic. It’s very tragic and in all, on all sorts of levels. But th- there is always, and you may not believe there is a better day ahead, but there actually is. There can be a better day ahead. You may not see it. It may take a, a day, a, a [02:22:00] week, a month, a year of going through hardship, but there is, there is better times ahead.
There always is a silver light at the end of the… Wow, I’m, I’m mixing metaphors. I think I am. It doesn’t matter. It doesn’t matter. Metaphors are meant to be mixed. Metaphors and thank God. Else we wouldn’t have the, if we hadn’t that phrase. Thank God. But that’s it. I mean, each… D- don’t give up. Never give up.
Well, I, I think there’s a, a beautiful thing to add to that is that if you decide that you can give up, you decide that you can take any path, and that’s the freedom that you actually have at that point. Yeah. If you’re ready to, to- Yeah … end your life, then, then you can actually go and go overseas, go to a different state, let go of whatever it is that’s actually you think is holding you down.
You can let go. Yeah. You let go of the religion that doesn’t work for you. You can let go of the, the relationships that aren’t right for you. You can let go the job that isn’t right for you. Exactly, and back in episode 100 and- Oh, so a real passionate point at this point. He’s onto it, isn’t he? Frigging roll.[02:23:00]
Sorry. I thought I picked up a pause. Maybe a pause? Oh, forgive me for breathing. Okay. Uh, back in episode- Yeah. No, you’re, you’re a radio announcer, Andrew. You- Back- You don’t breathe. Back in episode 140, Alison Marsland, mother of Richard Marsland, who, uh, killed himself, uh, her quote from that show when we talked about suicide was to let everybody know the world will not be better off without you.
Yeah. That’s the message that she wants to get into… The world will not Be better off without you. That’s the key takeout she took. Mm. We have one last eulogy to play, and we’re not gonna comment after it ’cause Michael has suggested, he’s listened to them, that this might be a nice way to finish this whole segment.
It’s by the person who’s known me the least amount of time, Nigel Dobson-Keefe. Anything to say, Michael? Well, it was actually Nigel’s eulogy that let me, you know, made me come to the conclusion to do them in this order. [02:24:00] Mm. Because you’ll hear it, and I think it’s a perfect little end to this section, but also I think because Nigel’s not here.
He gets to have the last word. Um, I’ll introduce Nigel. Nigel, you have the, the last word for now. It was a fortuitous meeting that led to my friendship with Steve. At the time, I was running a thinking and drinking meetup group. Steve rocked up. I wasn’t sure if it was for the thinking or the drinking, possibly the latter.
However, it soon appeared that Steve was there for both. His bottle of red wine was iconic. Effect of that would become important when our paths crossed again in a year or so. It was at this time that Steve started a podcast. An ex-radio tragic, the joy of talking and interviewing people never left him.
From the ’80s and ’90s and beyond on radio, by 2013, podcasting was easily accessible. With a job involving teaching social media, it [02:25:00] was only fair he put his mouth where his money was and started Another Boring Night in Adelaide podcast. At this stage, I was the emergency stand-in, co-conspirator, perhaps in every fifth show.
However, as the first stand-in, Steve named all the others after me as Nigel 2, Nigel 3, Nigel 4, et cetera, regardless of gender. By about the 80th show, the name and format had changed to The Adelaide Show, and as they say, the rest is history. Every week, we would head out to the city, suburbs, or country, interview the locals, and plow through the iconic red wine.
Steve was always open-minded, trying new ideas, incorporating video into the show. It was Steve’s idea to perform the podcast at the Adelaide Fringe. I was cautious and set the expectations low. However, the show, like everything Steve tried, was a success, and now it is time to close the final podcast, and in keeping with [02:26:00] tradition, it’s good night to Steve and good night to Don.
Enjoy a few reds with him
This is news
Okay, the theme for this week’s Is It News? is death, which can be a touchy topic. But I thought I’d go back in time and find old stories because I think– I thought maybe that, uh, distance of time might ease the burden of death. Uh, the first one is from the Sydney Morning Herald, March 13th, 1893. “Sudden death, Adelaide, Sunday.
Joseph Hanton, a prominent Freemason and forester, dropped dead suddenly on the street yesterday. The deceased witnessed his friend slip over and fall into the mud. The [02:27:00] mishap caused such a hearty fit of laughter that Hanton collapsed to the ground. Death was instantaneous and is attributed to heart failure.
He was sixty-three years of age.” Now, it’s plausible that might happen, and from hearing my eulogies tonight, it’s plausible people might laugh at that happening to me. But would that get printed in a newspaper? What year was it? It was 1893. Probably. I think of course it would. What else are we gonna talk about?
If, if if someone did die of laughter like that, that it’d be a, a piece of, uh, information also. People would know about it anyway ’cause Adelaide was very small in those days. And being a Mason, half of Adelaide would know. But die… It wasn’t dying of laughter. He died and everyone laughed, didn’t they? No, no.
He, he had– The mishap caused such a hearty fit of laughter- Oh, okay … that Hanton collapsed to the ground. Ooh. Death [02:28:00] was instantaneous. Uh, I haven’t apologized yet from earlier, Brett, but I will thank you for picking that up. Uh, I, y- you’ve helped save me from making an, an erroneous judgment there. Uh, I think that would be talked about.
Mm. And sounding plausible to me. Andrew? Me, I’m, um, I’m, um, picking up on the Bee Gees. I started a joke.
I started to cry. That’s well done. Well, and the joke was on him. So what are you thinking? Plausible? Plausible. Mm. Well, let’s wait and hear the other two. Oh, you’re so timid. You’re so big and bold on Five Double O. And here you’re being timid. No, I’m not being timid at all. I’m, I’m- We’ve all said that about Five Double O, haven’t we, all of our lives?
What? Yeah, that’s two against one ’cause I used to do talk back at Five Double O. Yes, we’ve always said that about Five Double O. Okay, next one. Michael, number one… number [02:29:00] two, please. Number two. This is from the Daily Post, 1911. Not dead, funeral canceled. Adelaide, Sunday. Mr. Patrick Boynan, an elderly painter, arrived on Friday at Moonee Ponds from Werribee and told some friends that his wife had died that morning.
He left to make arrangements for the funeral and gave the undertaker instructions for a death notice to be inserted in the newspapers. On Friday night, the undertaker received notice by telephone that when Mr. Boynan arrived home, he found his wife alive and sitting up in bed. Okay. I believe that. You believe that?
I believe that. Why? What does Mr Boylan know? Brett? I, I, I’d believe it too, but, uh, and it has a lot to do with, um, our diagnosis of death is one of the– Over history, one of the reasons why we have wakes was to do with actually putting the dead person in the middle of, of their [02:30:00] friends, making as much noise as you possibly could, which of course you had to get pissed for some reason to do that.
And, uh, and so you’d, you’d, you’d drink, you’d tell stories about the person, you’d do everything you could to wake them up. And, and medical science, uh, certainly back in the time of that, that being written wasn’t actually much better. And even today, a lot of people are diagnosed as being dead where they’re not.
What about the story about where people, um, were given the, the, the duty to have– There was a, a string around- The dead ringer … a dead ringer. Yeah. Yes, the dead ringer. What about that story, Brett? Yeah, yeah. So the, the string, what, what he’s talking about, uh, uh, Andrew’s talking about is the, um, string that used to be put inside the coffin ’cause unfortunately, and this is sad, so this is quite a gruesome thing, so only young people close your ears at this point.
Um, we would find when we dug up a lot of… Okay, during the, during the Victorian period, lots of cemeteries were dug up as they were moved to other places, and one of the things they discovered during that period but had in the past [02:31:00] was that, uh, there were scratch marks on the inside of a h- of a lot of coffins.
A lot of coffins. Um- So people were buried alive … and, and a lot were buried alive. So what they started doing was that they put a string inside the coffin, and then, and put a bell on the end of the string, and someone had to sit all night in the cemetery, uh, having two purposes: one, to watch for grave robbers, but the second, and they were the dead ringer, they were waiting to hear the bell rung.
That’s where that term came from. Oh. Yeah. Thank you very much, Brett. Yeah. Thank you. Um- Yeah … Thanks for bringing it up … where I am thinking this is a fake story- Mm … is that Michael Shanahan, if I ever got to write your eulogy- … I would talk about how you introduced me to the Australian writer Peter Carey and his amazingly vivid short stories- Mm
and novels. And this sounds like- He’s looking guilty. He is. This sounds like all the things that a Peter Carey would bring to a [02:32:00] story. Oh, int– But maybe that’s just my– Then maybe that’s why it caught my eye. It could, it could be that because you know what I– Darker, and I want– We actually are lining up some people to talk about this with domestic violence in this country, is was this man actually plotting to kill his wife and chickened out?
Mm. And that’s where my mind went, sadly, ’cause it’s a gruesome, horrible stain upon our society. Uh, and, um, that’s, that’s what I– another way that I was thinking about that story in particular. Mm. Mm. All right, number three. Question number three Number three. So I couldn’t go past this one. I couldn’t go past this one, given this is the anniversary of the Adelaide Show.
Okay Adelaide Times, 29th of March 1850. The Queen Dowager, death of the Queen Dowager. The London papers just received announced the melancholy [02:33:00] intelligence that Her Majesty the Queen Dowager departed this life at seven minutes before 2:00 on Sunday, December 2nd, to the great grief of Her Majesty and all the royal family, after a painful and protracted illness, which she bore with exemplary patience.
The following directions respecting Queen Adelaide’s funeral were given: “I die in all humility, knowing well that we are all alike before the throne of God, and I request therefore that my mortal remains be conveyed to the grave without any pomp or state. They are to be removed to St. George’s Chapel, Windsor, where I request to have as private and quiet a funeral as possible.
I particularly desire not to be laid out in state and the funeral to take place by daylight. No procession, the coffin to be carried by sailors to the chapel. I request not to be dissected or embalmed and to, [02:34:00] and desire to give as little trouble as possible.” Wow. That is exactly the reason why we have no qualms in making Queen Adelaide our late patron.
Because if you have a look at the Adelaide Show website where Colin Long’s done a, a little history of Queen Adelaide, she is a people among people, a person among people. She is an exemplar of what it is to be human. Even though she married in and is part of the royal family, uh, she brought her own crown, she was frugal.
Uh, she… It didn’t go to her head. She is, she is someone who- The crown, the crown didn’t Oh, the crown went to her head- … but the power didn’t. You know, she, she is, she is someone who is a worthy role model for all of us. Uh, and I blink and will hope that’s a true story. If it’s not, you’re walking home. Yeah, I was- Michael
I was thinking the same thing. I mean, [02:35:00] Michael- Again Had to walk home last week … couldn’t have actually created such blasphemy on the Adelaide Show to have actually made that as a negative. Yeah. I’m, I’m, I’m going for number one. Yeah. What was number one? Oh. Oh, dying from laughing. I’m going for number- Dying from laughing.
I’m going to question number two because of the, um- Actually, yeah … the Adelaide reference at the beginning. What was the Adelaide reference about? For number two. For number two. Yeah. Adelaide Sunday. Not dead. Funeral canceled. Adelaide Sunday. Why would they put that in Adelaide given that was in Moonee Ponds?
I don’t know. I didn’t write it. Didn’t you, Michael? Didn’t, didn’t you, Michael? It’s obviously true. So it’s obviously true. So I’m going for number one. Hey? So you’ve gone number one as a fake? Number one. Okay. I don’t know why. Probably because of the wine and I have to go to the toilet. What was number one again?
Okay. The, the laughing, dying of laughter. Number one’s dying of laughter. Yeah. I’d rather go for number two as being the fake Brett’s going number two. I’m going to, given that I’ve known Brett the longest, I’m gonna throw my lot in with him, and he is now [02:36:00] responsible for our fate. Oh, really? I like that. I like that.
Now, I’ve just noticed that if, if everyone’s just noticed, Steve’s actually, uh, whole way of living his life Blaming me for so many decisions, and you know exactly that. And I could- Now, does anyone want to hear a story? No. I’ve only known, uh, you a short time, Brett, but I don’t blame him. All right. Yeah, well done.
Michael- Well- … please take us out of- I blame you as well. Take us out of our misery. Well, the third story, the story of Queen Adelaide- Yes … obviously is true. Thank God. Oh, thank- That is a true story. Thank God. Thank you, Michael. Still got to hate you. And look, it’s– I think it’s amazing. God save our gracious queen.
What’s the next bit? I don’t know. We didn’t actually sing that, did we? It was her husband, wasn’t it? Hmm. I found it surprising that she died on December 2nd, but it didn’t– the message didn’t reach Adelaide until the 29th of March. Well, on a ship. Yeah. Yeah. That’s right. Yeah. What a different world. It was a [02:37:00] different world.
The queen could be dead for months. Difference in time. Well, they didn’t have the internet. 1850. December 2nd, and then this wasn’t printed until 29th of March Wow. Hmm. ‘Cause it didn’t actually take that long to get from England to Australia in, in actuality. So it’s interesting that the, the, possibly at that point in time, the trade winds and all that other kind of stuff took, made it take so long.
Trade winds? Trade winds. Those things they, they use. Where did you pull trade winds from? Oh, I spent time with- It was three months in a ship. I’m in, I’m in this, I’m with, I’m with sailors that, at the RSL, and they spent their whole time talking about the winds around the trade winds and, and all that. He- Mariah.
You listen, you listen to the other record I- Mariah. They call the wind Mariah. Oh, there’s the beauty of, the beauty of old TV shows. You listen to the other record I had access to. Seekers sing their big hits ’cause they had, “Bound for South Australia.” Yeah. “Heaving away, haul away.” [02:38:00] Of course, it was, “The carnival is over.”
Oh, no. Which would be more relevant for today. It would be, would be. Okay, okay. Well, come on. I’m thrilled to say that Brett and Steve are incorrect. Oh. Oh, no. The second story was a true story, and it was the first story that was made up. Totally made up? And that was well written- No … Michael. It wasn’t totally made up.
It was sl- it was, I… It was a combination of like, when I searched for laugh themselves to death- Yeah … which was the search that I did. Oh, my G- Yeah. It only hurts when I’m laughing. As you do. There were over, there were about 100 stories- Wow … of people laughing themselves to death. Really? Yeah. So this was a bit of a mishmash.
That’ll stop people being happy. It must be a common thing. So you took a, you took a common theme from- Yeah … a funeral notice? Uh, it was the… I don’t know, I don’t think they were all funeral notices. They were stories. I don’t think- You, you wrote it really well. Yeah. You did. So this is like a mishmash of them.
Wow. So it was common. Well done, Andrew. Yeah. Well done. I had no idea what you were talking about. [02:39:00] We’ve had 27 bottles of wine. It’s, I need to say, when we replay Is It News this coming Sunday night on Five Double A, you need to feign ignorance and get it wrong. Oh, don’t worry. I won’t remember. Michael, thank you.
Thank you. You’ve got one more Is It News in you next week when we’re at the Royal Adelaide Showgrounds. I can’t wait. Are you doing it the, are you doing it at the show? Yeah. How’d you get a gig there? Uh, we just asked. We’re gonna have the Adelaide show, Royal Adelaide Show episode. Thank you, Michael.
And now with Musical Pilgrimage for your listening pleasure, here’s Dan Drummond
Finally tonight, our musical pilgrimage continues, and Dan Drummond, who’s our musical curator, when he heard we were talking about death, said, “Would it be too much if I suggested a song that I wrote?” So he wrote the lyrics to this song [02:40:00] called Oh Brother, and Alan O’Toole from The Shambolics, a band that we love here on The Adelaide Show, uh, we played them in a very, very early episode, and they taught us the, uh, the saying, poke mahone.
They’ve got a great so- uh, song called Poke Mahone, which is brilliant. Um, you can hear them back in the early days. Uh, and so I said, “No, uh, no problem whatsoever. Let’s have a listen to this song you wrote.” Um, but Michael, you said something about the song last week. Dan Drummond picked a ripper. Oh, I love that song.
That’s probably my favorite song that I’ve heard on The Adelaide Show since I started listening. I, I tried to find her, whether she had an album or not, but I couldn’t find anything on Google. But it was fantastic. Beautiful voice. And that’s Hannah Yates and the song about the Stolen Generation. Yeah. Uh, and she came from a beautiful angle, uh, recorded live in Prospect, too.
So he’s on a good thing. At the moment, though, he is in Ireland, which is his mother country. Uh, so let’s have [02:41:00] him now combine with Alan O’Toole, and here is the song Oh Brother
I was only fifteen when my heart first bled. My dad’s brother found another in his lover’s bed. Well, he sank into depression, was a suicidal trap. He took more than just his own life when he took his final nap. And it’s around this time every single year. Yeah, it’s around this time every single year Then ten years ago my heart again stood still My best friend’s little brother took a [02:42:00] party pill.
He was only trying to have himself a little bit of fun. Too young to understand all the damage he had done. And it’s around this time every single year. Yeah, it’s around this time every single year. Well, it’s around this time every single year When I lose my mind, my senses disappear. And I want to take the van head off the coast The Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost[02:43:00]
Now it was four years ago, almost to the day. I was over in the west, a family holiday. When I got a text message, my soul brother had died. And ever since that day, my broken heart has cried. And it’s around this time every single [02:44:00] year. Yeah, it’s around this time every single year. Well, it’s around this time every-
When I lose my mind, my senses disappear I want to take the van head up the coast
The father, the son, and the Holy Ghost. And it doesn’t get better, time, it doesn’t heal. I want to wake up to find it isn’t real
The Father, the Son, or the Holy Ghost. The Father, the Son, or the [02:45:00] Holy Ghost
Alan O’Toole of The Shambolics and Big Bro- well, is it Big Brother then? Oh, brother. It’s been a big show. It’s been a huge show. It’s been a little bit longer than the normal show, but I think my life was worth it. That was actually well said, Steve. Um, it’s been an absolute joy. It’s been actually a grueling experience.
There’s one thing I’ve, I fear, Andrew, you know this, working in radio, sometimes you can skim across the surface and do all the things that sound right But it’s a real moment to remember when it’s deeply real. Maybe it’s just how I used to do radio. But, um, there’s a, there’s, ’cause my, my- Oh, you’re such a bitch.
And, and that we remember Steve by. No, I mean, I used to skate- No, no, no, no. Skate across the surface. No, no, no, I’m, I’m- Yeah. Uh, ’cause my, my parents used to… My [02:46:00] dad learned faster than my mum when I was talking about something and, you know, my yodeling or whatever, my mum would go and buy yodeling tapes for me.
I’d say, “It was just radio talk. We, it’s just radio talk.” Now he says, “Was it just podcast talk, Steve?” Well, it certainly isn’t. I’m actually trying to have your style, Andrew, which is that all real all the timeness about it. You just saved yourself, didn’t you? What? After what you said earlier about, um, depth.
No, I don’t know what you’re talking about, Brett Williams, and I’ve known him for more years than I care to remember. Anyway, it’s been a, a fascinating experience tonight. It has been a fascinating experience. I, I really wanna, again, thank you guys for allowing me into your circle of trust. I mean, uh, just learn more about you, Steve, learn more about your friendships and the relationships that you’ve built over your lifetime, and I wish you many more years to come, mate.
Because I, I really love you being on the program and being a, a, a part of [02:47:00] the, the fabric of Adelaide society and what you contribute. Thank you, Andrew Rimer. Thank you very much. And also, I’ve appreciated learning about your… the dab hand with which you must do your celebrancy. Mm. ‘Cause you pulled that Hu- uh, Victor Hugo piece out, and that was a consummate move.
That was the move that would’ve, uh, whenever, if ever you’ve, whenever you’ve used that in, in ceremonies, would’ve left people with things of depth to talk about over their cup of tea before they rush off and to think about in the, in the weeks and mo- uh, moments that follow. So thank you. Brett, thank you.
Uh, yeah, I actually wanna say thank you to Andrew because, um, and I- would be for the opposite reason of that. Uh, in the fact that that was a prepared piece that he actually had there, but the actual things that he used to reflect far deeper at each point gave us a real gift, I think, in this, this show. Um, so thank you, Andrew, for, for that.
I [02:48:00] think it was, um, magnificent what you, you’ve given to me, at least during this time. And, and of course, Michael as well, and Steven as well, as we’ve actually journeyed through, uh, you know, four different Experiences of death and life and reflection- Mm … on that. And- Can I, can I just say, um, I’ve really appreciated g- getting to know Michael, getting to know Brett, and of course I’ve known you for a number of years now, Steve.
But I’m, I’m, I’m really picking up on a real vibe of, uh, there’s Paul, there’s Ringo, there’s George There’s John. I reckon we could do something. And then now- I mean, if, if you ever want to take off your shoes- … I’m really glad that Ringo has joined us. … if you ever wanna take off your shoes and walk across the crossing in a white suit, we are with you.
Well, on that note- Uh, except the problem being I’m Paul. Oh, you’re Paul. Who are you? Uh, I feel like John Lennon. John Lennon? Yeah. You? Oh, I don’t know [02:49:00] who these people are. R- Ringo. Oh, Ringo. Yeah, I’ll be Ringo. Yeah, so- Well, I’m happy to be George … it was a gift, wasn’t it? I’m happy to be George. Yeah, yeah.
Okay. I am happy to be George. May- The deep one. Brett and Andrew, Brett and Andrew, here are your Adelaide show pens as a little token for being on our show tonight. Thank you. May you pen many beautiful services with those. Th- this isn’t a bottle of wine No, no, we- … this will last longer. You can write about wine with it.
Yeah. Michael Shanahan, thank you yet again. Thank you, Steven. And I just had a thought. You’ve done me a big favor because now I don’t need to come to your funeral- … because I’ve already got my eulogy prerecorded. Well, fair enough. Now, one last thing we’re- There- there’s your slideshow. We’re about to stop recording now.
Uh, there is something in the oven, uh, because back in the early days when this podcast began three years ago, uh, Colin, Brett, and I used to sit around and have some apple pie and some cream or ice cream after each recording session. We’re gonna do [02:50:00] that tonight to honor the tradition, the ceremony, the ritual, uh, before we go off into the night, so.
Can you … While you’re doing that, can I ask you what… While you are doing that, can I have more red wine? Of course you can. Thank you. I think it’s re- I think it’s pretty requisite. Brought to you by Bleasdale and Jacobs Creek. Yes, indeed. I think Jacobs, yeah, Jacobs Creek snuck in there. Sponsored by Adelaide Night and Day Family Therapy.
And, and next week- Andrew Ryan, the celebrant. That’s right. We will put the links to both of your websites. Have you got a website, Andrew, for your celebrancy? Steve will do it for you. Don’t worry about it. Yeah, we’ll, we’ll make a link so people can email you. We’ve, we’ve got a problem in the fact that the, uh…
given that you’ve done this so many times with the, with the apple crumble- Mm … uh, uh, you didn’t actually read the instructions, did you, in terms of the amount of time it takes to, to cook? Oh, okay. We might be here for a bit longer. Mm. Oh. All right. Anyway, that’ll happen eventually, uh, before our fourth birthday at least.
Did you take the plastic off? I don’t know, Brett. Mm. You… Brett whacked it in. Oh, he never took the [02:51:00] plastic off. Yeah, sorry. Oh. Next week- I’m nervous … next week on the show, we’re recording at the headquarters of the Royal Adelaide Show. We’re looking forward to that. The SA goodie bags, gourmet goodie bags people are dropping some off for us to sample for you as well.
Mm. Hope you can join us next week. Until then, thank you, Michael Shanahan, again. Thank you. Good night from me, Steve Davis. Good night, Don. What name badge do you have, or what’s your company name when you trade as a celebrant? Um, Andrew Reimer, Registered Civil Celebrant. So I’m a marriage re- uh, certified civil marriage celebrant, but also a funeral celebrant as well.
Right. How long did it take you to come up with that name? Andrew Reimer? Mm. I thank my parents. Yeah. They did a good job. They did. It’s quite catchy, really, isn’t it? It is quite… Well, it, it’s quite interesting because I’m, I come from a family of German migrants. Mm. So Mom and Dad were Gerhard and Anna.
They, um, arrived here in 1960. They came aboard the Castelfelice with my two older brothers, Wolfgang and Hans Joachim. Mm. I was [02:52:00] born here. You don’t reckon I’m happy?
Andrew. Thank you very much. Hans Joachim. Hans Joachim und Wolfgang, danke schön. I think, I think the rest of the family would look at you and go, “There’s no rhyme or reason with that name.” No, that’s exactly right. Oh, very funny. Also tonight- This Adelaide Show podcast was produced by Steve Davis and Michael Shanahan.
Michael helps kids by day and is exhausted by night. Steve is my daddy and a marketer by day. This has been Alexandra Davis, and for the record, my daddy is nearly always late, but he’s getting better at it. And my name is Caitlin Davis, and I agree with everything my sister said, but I have one more thing to say.
If you have enjoyed this [02:53:00] show, would you please tell a friend about it? Because the more people who listen, the happier my daddy is. And if you really liked it, you could leave a review on iTunes. Thanks for listening. Thanks for listening.
[02:54:00]